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Racing Chat Thread

mowgli77

By mowgli77
in At The Races - Racing Forum

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Tedthewolf
Tedthewolf

What next!!! Trainer took money for horse that did not exist  BY TONY MCFADDEN1:00PM 5 FEB 2016  Australia: Trainer Michael John Day is facing jail for dishonestly obtaining financial ad

BillyHills
BillyHills

Surely it would only be IN the rules if they did pay on the double result, if they don't then that wouldn't need to be mentioned as it's only concessions that need to be pointed out to their customers

Trotter
Trotter

I suppose that's one advantage of betting in a betting shop.......if your winner is subsequently disqualified you've got your money in your pocket and you're half way home Of course, you've got to liv

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Banner

Banner

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Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread Firstly sorry for posting in the wrong thread first time round. Anyway im new to betting on horse racing I understand the basic's and have been betting no tennis and football for many years. After reading Patrick Vietch's book Id like to get into horse racing, I obviously know I will never make the money he has. Anyway my question is: In the handicap race's the higher rated horses get weights put on them to make the race more even, am i correct? Where can I find how much weight has been added to horses? Thanks

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BillyHills

BillyHills

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Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread Banner; In a handicap race a horse is allotted anything between 10.0 stone and 11st.12lbs to carry by the handicappers which is a difference of 26lbs from top to bottom. After each race a horse will be assessed and given a rating which is the OR on the racecard. Depending on what rating the horse gets dictates which races he can run in, so for example a horse rated 103 will be able to run in a 0-105 handicap. In this 0-105 race lets say there is a runner which is rated 105, he will be allotted top weight and have to carry 11st 12lbs, and the horse rated 103 will carry 2 lbs less at 11st 10lbs and so on. Its not quite that straight forward as most often there won't be a runner rated 105 so the next highest will automatically carry the top weight. If you look on the race card below you will see the weights just before the trainers name. In this example the race is a 0-125 handicap and Cootehill is rated 125 so carries 11st 12lbs. If you look to the right the OR will tell you its current rating, the TS is the beat speed figure and the RPR is the Racing Post Rating. At the end of the day its up to us punters to decide which horse has the best chance off its current rating which is not always the best horse in the race. 6mdc.png

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BillyHills

BillyHills

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Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread Well its not extra weight exactly its just the right weight for its ability compared to the other runners. Its not to be confused with penalties; Sometimes on the race card you will see something like (6lbsX) next to its name, this is after a horse has won and races again within ten days and the handicapper hasn't had time to alter its rating. The horse must carry 6lbs extra for this run automatically until it has been reassessed and given a new rating. Connections will often run their horses with the penalties as they know they will get more than the 6lbs added in the future so theretically is well handicapped. The penalties are only awarded to previous winners. Many punters use these horses in systems, winners that run within a week etc… Ralphie's Quick System uses a variant of this.

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Snoopdog

Snoopdog

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Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread McCririck loses age discrimination suit. Lots of newspaper articles - if you go to "Google News" and search "John McCririck". I heared him on Radio 4's Today show, this morning. I think his voice has changed a little - has he had a stroke ? It seems he had some sympathy from Lesley Graham (I never liked her sickly, sweet style) and Tommo, though Tommo stated they were not close (that means they disliked each other a lot). He did have a point about the "suits and skirts" wanting to put in changes to prove themselves, but overall I feel his case had no merit. He has 2 houses in a Ritzy part of London. His lawsuit was no win - no fee (lots of free publicity), though he paid the barrister. I doubt he has improved his chances of more (haven't seen him in a while) work on ATR.

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Lodge

Lodge

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Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread Was wondering if somebody could help me with something I haven't really noticed too much before. What/Why are there differences between Irish and UK official ratings? I'll give an example to illustrate why I am asking the question... tomorrow in the 2.40 @ Cheltenham - Free To Dream makes his debut for Venetia Williams yard, he was a horse I followed in Ireland earlier this year and thought he was capable of winning a handicap off a mark in the low 120's. Anyway he starts life in the UK tomorrow in a handicap off 130, 7lbs higher than his last mark over in Ireland and I was just wondering why the higher mark really?

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BillyHills

BillyHills

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Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread Irish racing has a different WFA scale, its way out of line with ours. Basically its means a young horse in Ireland will run off a lower scale and earn a rating and carry that through for the rest of its career, when it races in another country the rating is then converted to the host country's Weight For Age scale and it just so happens that it means a rise when racing in the UK. BHA has a paper explaining it somewhere i remember?

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Lodge

Lodge

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Irish racing has a different WFA scale, its way out of line with ours. Basically its means a young horse in Ireland will run off a lower scale and earn a rating and carry that through for the rest of its career, when it races in another country the rating is then converted to the host country's Weight For Age scale and it just so happens that it means a rise when racing in the UK. BHA has a paper explaining it somewhere i remember?
Thanks for the reply. Makes sense I suppose, just couldn't see much on the topic when I googled it. Will definitely be keeping that one in my notebook for this season though!
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Blazing Bailey

Blazing Bailey

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Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread

Irish racing has a different WFA scale, its way out of line with ours. Basically its means a young horse in Ireland will run off a lower scale and earn a rating and carry that through for the rest of its career, when it races in another country the rating is then converted to the host country's Weight For Age scale and it just so happens that it means a rise when racing in the UK. BHA has a paper explaining it somewhere i remember?
That's good to know! So in Lodge's example, theoretically it would be better to work out an Irish raider's likely handicap rating potential by comparing the collateral form of his Irish runs before comparing it to his current Irish OR instead of his English OR? Im not sure that's particularly clear so I will give an example! In Ireland = Say horse A wins by 5 lengths, horse B then runs to 115 for his next outing. That would theoretically make horse A rated 120. In the UK = Horse C wins by 5 lengths. Horse D runs off 125 NTO making Horse C off 130 NTO. When the Irish horse comes over here, Horse A gets rated at 130 based on his Irish form. I would have previously then assumed that horse D had a better chance of winning because his form in the UK meant that he was weighted closer to his official mark based on his previous form. However, due to the WFA scale, Horse A is likely to have the same winning chance as Horse D because both would be weighted to their OR? Unless I can calculate the WFA scale for the Irish horse I am better off basing my analysis on the Irish OR instead of the UK one? It would explain why I have never been any good at picking the Irish raiders in March!
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Aidymac

Aidymac

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Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread

I know mate' date=' but he should never of had to fight to get his cash, Coral showed themselves up digging in their heels.[/quote'] Well to be fair, he did draw a line after 3 horses which does mean 2 seperate bets. He also never wrote anything on the docket other than £1.. His only saving grace was the cashier put it in as a Sevenfold, he was entitled to his money but he should be a bit more responsible when writing out his bet too.
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Jimmy2shoes

Jimmy2shoes

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Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread

Well to be fair, he did draw a line after 3 horses which does mean 2 seperate bets. He also never wrote anything on the docket other than £1.. His only saving grace was the cashier put it in as a Sevenfold, he was entitled to his money but he should be a bit more responsible when writing out his bet too.
Yeh fair point.
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robertob

robertob

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Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread Some ride by Tommy Barry to win the Grade 1 Singapore Gold Cup on Tropaios, coming from last to first. But I think the racing authorities over there should tweak the whip rules. That doesn't look really nice how some jockeys using their stick in the finish...

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BillyHills

BillyHills

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Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread Is Irish racing losing its appeal due to the domination of Willie Mullins? I just cant be bothered with it to be honest, it just seems a Mullins/Walsh benefit and i know now why Ruby chose now to abandon Nicholls. So many big races seem very uncompetitive or am i not seeing the whole picture? Plenty of Irish guys on here, what do you think?

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Aidymac

Aidymac

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Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread

Is Irish racing losing its appeal due to the domination of Willie Mullins? I just cant be bothered with it to be honest, it just seems a Mullins/Walsh benefit and i know now why Ruby chose now to abandon Nicholls. So many big races seem very uncompetitive or am i not seeing the whole picture? Plenty of Irish guys on here, what do you think?
Mate, it is horrendous. Ruby had 5 winners from 5 rides yesterday, all in his stride too, he didn't have to work for them. Morgiana hurdle, Mullins had 4 of the 5 runners, boring of the highest order. If the racing in Ireland was good I would be travelling all over the country for it, but I couldn't be bothered. The only thing I would say is I think Irish horses are kept much fresher than the horses in the UK and that is why they do so well at Cheltenham, but for racing I would love to live in the UK,
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Trotter

Trotter

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Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread

It must be quite a challenge spending a day in a studio with David Cleary. So dour.
I think him and Dave Yates of the Mirror both have a very annoying habit of interminably pausing their speech for no apparent reason...........it must be very difficult for the presenter wondering whether they're going to get a sentence out
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