erhaab1965 Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread Altering prices of horses after they have been withdrawn is a scam by bookies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aidymac Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread I have encountered these types of staff in all my time of betting. It is the fault of the bookie operators who don't put enough effort into training staff. They are cutting corners , they employ people who have no /little interest in betting. Was in a Betfred shop and noticed you could back the favorite in a derivative market at 10/11 to beat the field and in the normal market it was 4/5.When I questioned him if it was a mistake he couldn't answer , infact he couldn't even understand what the derivative market was !! This guy was in his mid 50s been in the industry for 3 years having been made redundant in another industry , and just been promoted to deputy manager. The guy was OK but had no comprehension of horse racing or betting other than his basic training. I agree with you there, there are a lot of people that really don't have a clue what they are doing in betting shops. In fact, I know a bunch of lads that used walk into a Hacketts bookmakers a few years back on a Sunday, if there was an early Kick off at 12:45 or so they would walk in at 2:30pm at the end of the game and back the first goalscorer after he had scored, they even pulled off 20 quid on a 33/1 fulham defender one day. :lol It went on for weeks, they made a killing but then head office found out and the girl was sacked. I have a friend (female) who also works in a betting shop, nice girl, but thick as a plank. She was accepting Irish placepots even though the bookies here don't take placepots on Irish meetings. A lot of the staff know zilch about sport, are terrible at math, not good enough in many shops. 8am opening time? Jeez, all our bookmakers open at 10am earliest here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kev2oo9 Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread I agree with you there, there are a lot of people that really don't have a clue what they are doing in betting shops. In fact, I know a bunch of lads that used walk into a Hacketts bookmakers a few years back on a Sunday, if there was an early Kick off at 12:45 or so they would walk in at 2:30pm at the end of the game and back the first goalscorer after he had scored, they even pulled off 20 quid on a 33/1 fulham defender one day. :lol It went on for weeks, they made a killing but then head office found out and the girl was sacked. I have a friend (female) who also works in a betting shop, nice girl, but thick as a plank. She was accepting Irish placepots even though the bookies here don't take placepots on Irish meetings. A lot of the staff know zilch about sport, are terrible at math, not good enough in many shops. 8am opening time? Jeez, all our bookmakers open at 10am earliest here Haha that's class. Laddies and corals 9pm here , wh 10 apart from Saturdays Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy2shoes Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread I'd love to know what Ladbrokes store is open at 8 o clock in the morning. Many of them in Scotland open at 8am, so does a lot of the Betfreds, depends on area, ''competition'' for business. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy2shoes Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread I have encountered these types of staff in all my time of betting. It is the fault of the bookie operators who don't put enough effort into training staff. They are cutting corners , they employ people who have no /little interest in betting. Was in a Betfred shop and noticed you could back the favorite in a derivative market at 10/11 to beat the field and in the normal market it was 4/5.When I questioned him if it was a mistake he couldn't answer , infact he couldn't even understand what the derivative market was !! This guy was in his mid 50s been in the industry for 3 years having been made redundant in another industry , and just been promoted to deputy manager. The guy was OK but had no comprehension of horse racing or betting other than his basic training. A woman in my local magic sign shop once asked me if 3/1 was better than 7/2 When she's on the counter i just walk up and tell her the price of the horse, most times she just writes it down, sometimes it works sometimes it don't, she's also paid out a few times in the past without deducting the Rule 4. She even paid me one day as a winner, but my horse was in a DH finish, but the result always goes in Number order, she just looked up and could see my horse at the top ''Like in 1st place'' the line wasn't scanning so she just paid out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bathtime For Rupert Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread A woman in my local magic sign shop once asked me if 3/1 was better than 7/2 When she's on the counter i just walk up and tell her the price of the horse, most times she just writes it down, sometimes it works sometimes it don't, she's also paid out a few times in the past without deducting the Rule 4. She even paid me one day as a winner, but my horse was in a DH finish, but the result always goes in Number order, she just looked up and could see my horse at the top ''Like in 1st place'' the line wasn't scanning so she just paid out. Is it not all automatic? I was in a shop once where a girl behind the counter had given a price to a punter but when he went to collect they said that price was never available and thus couldn't pay out at the given odds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erhaab1965 Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread Eagle Top a 3YO trained by John Gosden is a horse I have been highly impressed with since winning at Royal Ascot , I backed ante post at 8/1 for the King George which he finished 4th at odds of 9/2. Last week I noticed him in the betting for the Juddmonte but was not confident enough to place an ante post bet , also he is prominent in the betting for the St Ledger. Earlier this evening the RP reported him as not going for either the Juddmonte or the St Ledger , it says "as of two or three days ago we certainly weren't doing it." If it was known 3 days ago he isn't going for the St Ledger , why is he still in the betting at odds of 9/2 !! Some bookies has even shortened him since the release of this story !!!!! Foooking crooks . You can have as much as you like on it , no restrictions !! When the bookies suspects a mini touch by somebody like BJ Curley they slash odds instantly . A NR they shorten the odds to make it appear as if its been backed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy2shoes Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread Is it not all automatic? I was in a shop once where a girl behind the counter had given a price to a punter but when he went to collect they said that price was never available and thus couldn't pay out at the given odds. Think she was just paying out on trust, the staff in a few shops know me, the mail girl has ended up talking a few times and missed the rule 4, even when I've walked away I've been surprised she missed a rule 4 I did say to er one day she gave me £286 - but the return was only £86 lol - i was in a good mood and had a nice streak, had it been recent id not have said a thing and walked out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danj2202 Posted August 19, 2014 Share Posted August 19, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread I'd love to know what Ladbrokes store is open at 8 o clock in the morning. Some shops open at 7.30am the general thought process seems to be the longer you are open the more turnover you will take. Lunacy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danj2202 Posted August 19, 2014 Share Posted August 19, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread Eagle Top a 3YO trained by John Gosden is a horse I have been highly impressed with since winning at Royal Ascot , I backed ante post at 8/1 for the King George which he finished 4th at odds of 9/2. Last week I noticed him in the betting for the Juddmonte but was not confident enough to place an ante post bet , also he is prominent in the betting for the St Ledger. Earlier this evening the RP reported him as not going for either the Juddmonte or the St Ledger , it says "as of two or three days ago we certainly weren't doing it." If it was known 3 days ago he isn't going for the St Ledger , why is he still in the betting at odds of 9/2 !! Some bookies has even shortened him since the release of this story !!!!! Foooking crooks . You can have as much as you like on it , no restrictions !! When the bookies suspects a mini touch by somebody like BJ Curley they slash odds instantly . A NR they shorten the odds to make it appear as if its been backed. A few years ago at cheltenham binocular wasnt running in the champion hurdle 3 weeks before he won the champion hurdle. You never remove a horse from a race until you pass a declaration stage where it is no longer in the race. That really is quite simple Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertob Posted August 19, 2014 Share Posted August 19, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread Beautiful documentary about racing in South Africa - it goes behind the scenes, and it looks back on the the countries richest and most prestigious race - the Durban July. Well worth to watch, if you have half an hour to spare: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcYB6k09rxo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcYB6k09rxo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aidymac Posted August 19, 2014 Share Posted August 19, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread Some shops open at 7.30am the general thought process seems to be the longer you are open the more turnover you will take. Lunacy Madness!!! You won't find a shop open before 10am here, 9:30 sometimes at weekends. Surely being open that early is costing them more instead of raking in profits? Are there people that are in bookmakers at 7:30am? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danj2202 Posted August 19, 2014 Share Posted August 19, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread Apparently so. On the way to work etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arsenalfh Posted August 19, 2014 Share Posted August 19, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread Would Joseph's issues getting to a low enough weight to ride Australia tomorrow put you off backing him? He may not be in top physical condition if he puts himself under to much strain but then again Australia does seem the class act of the field. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toast Posted August 19, 2014 Share Posted August 19, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread Australia is a lay for me at 4/5. 1/ Joseph is trying to lose weight for the ride, bit strange considering Ryan Moore was available. 2/ both his defeats, seasonal debuts or after a long break. Maybe he needs a recent run to put him straight. 3/ his derby win is not really working out and he never put any clear daylight between the 2nd horse despite being labelled the next wonder horse. 4/ in the Irish derby, his victory was against horses who you would struggle to bet in a group 3. 5/ up against 2 group 1 winning course and distance winners. the Great Gatsby and Mukhadram who will be more suited to this course than he was at Ascot. He could very well win quite easily, but I've seen better odds on chances in worse fields. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy2shoes Posted August 19, 2014 Share Posted August 19, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread A few years ago at cheltenham binocular wasnt running in the champion hurdle 3 weeks before he won the champion hurdle. You never remove a horse from a race until you pass a declaration stage where it is no longer in the race. That really is quite simple Could you name two other occasions ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danj2202 Posted August 19, 2014 Share Posted August 19, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread Could you name two other occasions ?? You miss my point. My point being if the horse is still in the decs you dont remove it. If somebody is stupid enough to bet it.....well they deserve to lose Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erhaab1965 Posted August 19, 2014 Share Posted August 19, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread Could you name two other occasions ?? kicking king was reported to be out of the Gold Cup after his King George win, then romps home at Cheltenham Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erhaab1965 Posted August 19, 2014 Share Posted August 19, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread You miss my point. My point being if the horse is still in the decs you dont remove it. If somebody is stupid enough to bet it.....well they deserve to lose That is rubbish, it is blatantly taking advantage of punters who are not up to speed with technology. Punters in their 50s and older who have traditionally indulged in ante post betting more so than today's generation are more likely to be exploited.Some of them dont even own a mobile phone, never mind having a computer. What sort of person are you to say they deserve to lose? If a horse is declared to be a non runner, bookies should remove it from the betting despite still being declared. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danj2202 Posted August 19, 2014 Share Posted August 19, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread But as stated there are occasions when horses are stated by trainers not to be running yet remain declared to run and eventually run. What would you have happen if a horse is taken out of the betting and you have placed your bet in a book not including a declared runner? Void all bets? Any punter who places a bet without having as much information as possible - a trainers quote that the horse is not running can be considered relevant here gets what they deserve. My apologies by the way as i didnt realise we were talking exclusively about pensioners in regards to this matter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hit Posted August 19, 2014 Share Posted August 19, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread I agree with you there, there are a lot of people that really don't have a clue what they are doing in betting shops. In fact, I know a bunch of lads that used walk into a Hacketts bookmakers a few years back on a Sunday, if there was an early Kick off at 12:45 or so they would walk in at 2:30pm at the end of the game and back the first goalscorer after he had scored, they even pulled off 20 quid on a 33/1 fulham defender one day. :lol It went on for weeks, they made a killing but then head office found out and the girl was sacked. I have a friend (female) who also works in a betting shop, nice girl, but thick as a plank. She was accepting Irish placepots even though the bookies here don't take placepots on Irish meetings. A lot of the staff know zilch about sport, are terrible at math, not good enough in many shops. 8am opening time? Jeez, all our bookmakers open at 10am earliest here Around 10 years ago, on a Saturday, you could wait nearly half an hour after the German Bundesliga matches started (14.30) to see if any teams were winning by a decent margin & walk into a shop & back them (before 15.00)..! The staff assumed the matches started at the same time as the Premier League!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy2shoes Posted August 19, 2014 Share Posted August 19, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread Madness!!! You won't find a shop open before 10am here, 9:30 sometimes at weekends. Surely being open that early is costing them more instead of raking in profits? Are there people that are in bookmakers at 7:30am? Yes, even at those early times most seats at the roulette machines are filled. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy2shoes Posted August 19, 2014 Share Posted August 19, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread You miss my point. My point being if the horse is still in the decs you dont remove it. If somebody is stupid enough to bet it.....well they deserve to lose Understand what your saying, but its not clever when a bookmakers can make cash on a persons stupidity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danj2202 Posted August 19, 2014 Share Posted August 19, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread I take your point and raise all in with fobt's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erhaab1965 Posted August 19, 2014 Share Posted August 19, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread The whole point of ante post betting is to back a horse at much bigger odds in the hope it turns up on the day at much shorter odds. In recent years I have noticed that ante post odds are no longer attractive , the long range odds are often too short. Take a look at the odds for the Arc which is always run on the first Sunday , the odds on the day will most likely be more generous than what you get now and there will be less horses on the day , Plus the Arc trails have yet to be run !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy2shoes Posted August 19, 2014 Share Posted August 19, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread The whole point of ante post betting is to back a horse at much bigger odds in the hope it turns up on the day at much shorter odds. In recent years I have noticed that ante post odds are no longer attractive , the long range odds are often too short. Take a look at the odds for the Arc which is always run on the first Sunday , the odds on the day will most likely be more generous than what you get now and there will be less horses on the day , Plus the Arc trails have yet to be run !! The French PMU can also be better odds than the UK market, you can still bet on the French PMU via our crook shops. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillyHills Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread New Approach was another example of a horse not going to run. Its a futile argument, of course a horse will always be in the market unless its officially withdrawn at a declaration stage. You cant just be guessing which horse will run and which will not. In my opinion (i'm over 50 by the way, so i'm old and brainless) if anyone is brave enough to bet ante-post then at least do a little homework and try to find out if in fact its on the horses agenda. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erhaab1965 Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread Its a futile argument, of course a horse will always be in the market unless its officially withdrawn at a declaration stage. You cant just be guessing which horse will run and which will not. In my opinion (i'm over 50 by the way, so i'm old and brainless) if anyone is brave enough to bet ante-post then at least do a little homework and try to find out if in fact its on the horses agenda. That is rubbish. For years and years whenever a horse has been declared by the trainer to be not going for a particular race or is out for the season , the horse is removed from the betting and the market is reformed. Bookies did not wait until the declaration stage before removing it. Don't be twisting the essence of what I am saying , the over 50s are more likely to be adverse to technology , nothing to do with being old and brainless. My posts on this forum right from the time I joined has been about the protection of punters. Many of you mock me and try to counter what I say , that shows what type of people some of you are. It is morally and ethically wrong to take advantage of people in less fortunate circumstances , whether its being poor , unable to read , unable to calculate their returns , no access to internet / information or whatever... Some of you have a " haha he deserves to be screwed over " attitude. That is just wrong. Are you the type to applaud a second hand car salesman for selling a death trap of a car to a neighbour you don't like ? When walking past a homeless person on the street , do you turn your nose up at them and think to yourself " scumbag " , or do you stop and hand over a little spare change? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy2shoes Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 Re: Daily Racing Chat Thread Kingston Hill pulled out race, yet Bet365 - Stanjames & ladbrokes all still showing prices. Must be sleeping, or coming the C**T Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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