The Grim Reaper Posted September 22, 2008 Share Posted September 22, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £533.04 in Profit!!) £1000 a week for 60 weeks was the general jist of things, so £60k+ , unless you only bet 5 or less bets or markets a week , not sure , think it was 5 markets . Then they wont touch you . Basically its aim to get at the traders and bot users who are just scraping up mugs money , betting millions in turnover , causing all sorts of work for Betfair ,and winning all the time with no risk . All these small trades make up to big amounts and these are the people who they are making pay . Also aimed at the racing in running punters who bet the field for example at the off , in every race, due to the fact that they have advanced pics and are getting an unfair advantage. They dont mind losing their custom tbh , but if they want to stay they are making them pay the higher price . It may seem unfair but i bet you a pound to a penny that they all stay . The nobs on the forum who say they are leaving are talking pish too , and the few who do go to betdaq will soon realise theres nothing doing over there . Its a pitiful site . Thats another reason betfair have done what they have , becuase they can get away with it . Basically it wont affect us , unless we get on a very good streak , then the 20% will not hurt coz we`ll be minted . People who win 60k regularly dont generally post on forums either btw (bar me !!) Simply because they are traders and arbers getting things that are available for a very short time and they also dont want to give anything away . these people dont work they just make it on betfair . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Grim Reaper Posted September 22, 2008 Share Posted September 22, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £533.04 in Profit!!) Having read your threads Scotty i dont think this will affect you in any way m8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyXS Posted September 22, 2008 Author Share Posted September 22, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £533.04 in Profit!!) Having read your threads Scotty i dont think this will affect you in any way m8 :rollin:rollin I was the first person to post about receiving the BF letter dude- and teh actual email! So your talking utter baws pal. :ok And its not £1000 a week!! £1000 was, as I come to believe, the cutoff point after the 60 week period. :unsure If I've come to understand it correct, and theres also some matter of using over 250 markets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyXS Posted September 22, 2008 Author Share Posted September 22, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £533.04 in Profit!!) People who win 60k regularly dont generally post on forums either btw (bar me !!) This says it all :ok :rollin:rollin:rollin:rollin:rollin:rollin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyXS Posted September 22, 2008 Author Share Posted September 22, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £533.04 in Profit!!) Anyway, Im tired, just back from the gym and not getting into an argument with someone whose only contribution to the site have been - Dont think mr mac takes into account that its the carling cup and teams will play 11 different players from the norm Betdaq liquidity is awful . zero on racing in running and zero on football bar the odd big game. Also very few markets . You will soon learn , seriously . best of british btw :ok Having read your threads Scotty i dont think this will affect you in any way m8 £1000 a week for 60 weeks was the general jist of things, so £60k+ , unless you only bet 5 or less bets or markets a week , not sure , think it was 5 markets . Then they wont touch you . Basically its aim to get at the traders and bot users who are just scraping up mugs money , betting millions in turnover , causing all sorts of work for Betfair ,and winning all the time with no risk . All these small trades make up to big amounts and these are the people who they are making pay . Also aimed at the racing in running punters who bet the field for example at the off , in every race, due to the fact that they have advanced pics and are getting an unfair advantage. They dont mind losing their custom tbh , but if they want to stay they are making them pay the higher price . It may seem unfair but i bet you a pound to a penny that they all stay . The nobs on the forum who say they are leaving are talking pish too , and the few who do go to betdaq will soon realise theres nothing doing over there . Its a pitiful site . Thats another reason betfair have done what they have , becuase they can get away with it . Basically it wont affect us , unless we get on a very good streak , then the 20% will not hurt coz we`ll be minted . People who win 60k regularly dont generally post on forums either btw (bar me !!) Simply because they are traders and arbers getting things that are available for a very short time and they also dont want to give anything away . these people dont work they just make it on betfair . Unless you win £1000+ for 60 consecutive weeks then the premium charge will not affect you . Bremen - Anothosis was 1.02 midweek and celtic - Aalborg was 1.03 Is every bet 10/10 ? Start again big Mac . With the thought process you use you MUST win sooner or later :ok Wouldnt touch any bookie with yours ! 1-2 Ft 1-1 and last but not least- Hes on the ball is Zaki . People taking note now though and the goals could mdry up as he gets more attention than he has been :welcome to PL btw, you'll like it here ;) Scotty :ok Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Grim Reaper Posted September 23, 2008 Share Posted September 23, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £533.04 in Profit!!) Seriously mate i wasnt having a go . Im led to believe that you need to make at least 1k a week clear profit , and do that for a solid 60 week period (any 60 week period)before they charge you . Look at the Betfair forum on the services Q&A live section . It will only affect the top 5% of earners on there . Everyone got the email even if you hadnt used your account - ever- trust me i know !! What happens if you take a week off after 59 weeks ? Do you then start from scratch again ? And surely they cant take £200 off someone who wins £16 a week for 60 weeks ? What happens if you withdraw everything after 59 weeks ? People would just open new accs under diff names and start again , over and over . It would too difficult to police , hence they are targeting the top earners , the tried and trusted people who they know wont go anywhere coz theyre making too much to leave . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyXS Posted September 23, 2008 Author Share Posted September 23, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £533.04 in Profit!!) Seriously mate i wasnt having a go . Im led to believe that you need to make at least 1k a week clear profit , and do that for a solid 60 week period (any 60 week period)before they charge you . Look at the Betfair forum on the services Q&A live section . It will only affect the top 5% of earners on there . Everyone got the email even if you hadnt used your account - ever- trust me i know !! What happens if you take a week off after 59 weeks ? Do you then start from scratch again ? And surely they cant take £200 off someone who wins £16 a week for 60 weeks ? What happens if you withdraw everything after 59 weeks ? People would just open new accs under diff names and start again , over and over . It would too difficult to police , hence they are targeting the top earners , the tried and trusted people who they know wont go anywhere coz theyre making too much to leave . Fair enough GR. I did always wonder about that case, if you were to withdraw your money, and the fact that the premium charge (because it almost just withdraws money from your account after 60 weeks) could probably be avoided altogether, but then BF would surely just mark your account as being -£ so much, and when you deposited again it would be less that amount. Still, Im not a fan of it at all. Like Paul Ross said BF are starting to take too much for granted. I remember years ago when the Asian Handicap market on BF was marked at 1% commission, most markets were 3%, and some markets were 5%. I still use BF for some markets, but would rather use another exchange, when I can get matched. Betdaq are offering only 2% commission, and if you can get matched (on big events), that cant really be argued with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mediamonkey Posted September 23, 2008 Share Posted September 23, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £533.04 in Profit!!) Without wanting to hijack this thread too much, that's not the way I understand it GR. Basically, to be eligible for the premium charge, you have to: a) Be in profit overall since opening your account b) Have bet on at least 250 markets in the previous 60 weeks (this is backdated, so for this opening week it takes into account number of markets bet on since summer 2007!) c) Have generated* less than 20% of your total net profits in commission over the past 60 weeks (again this is backdated). There is no "£1,000 a week" condition anywhere. I think you may be getting confused with the £1,000 allowance per 60-week period, which means that you are only actually charged PC once the amount you are calculated to owe goes over £1,000. Lots of people seem to misunderstand it, though. AFAIK, it is the 60-week rolling total that is important, so for instance having a single bet at evens in a given week (and thus only paying max of 5% commission) does NOT mean that BF will sting you for an additional 15% in that week. Instead they look at your 60-week betting history, and only if your total commission generated is less than 20% of your net profits are you eligible. * "Generated" appears to mean commission paid by you plus commission paid by whoever matched your losing bets. So it's in your interest not to be matched by the "big hitters" on 2% rates. But how will you know? Answer - you won't, and you'll have to take BF's word for it that you got matched by a 2% boy rather than a 5% newbie. Hmmm.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Grim Reaper Posted September 23, 2008 Share Posted September 23, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £533.04 in Profit!!) Very very confusing tbth Media , diff people saying diff stuff .... The rules dont exactly explain themselves properly either . I do lots of bets on lots of markets , mostly racing , and a bit of trading,on a dialy basis , so 250 markets in 60 weeks is 5 bets a week , so thats less than 1 race a day !! I reckon i make a steady £100 to £150 a week by laying , only small wins but it all clearly adds up. Does that mean im gona get charged ? Im reckon ive touched 100 markets this week already and its only tuesday !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Intensity Posted September 23, 2008 Share Posted September 23, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £533.04 in Profit!!) TGR, it all depends on this part c) Have generated* less than 20% of your total net profits in commission over the past 60 weeks (again this is backdated). I've read the whole statement a few times and I'm not sure I understand it:lol:lol:lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mediamonkey Posted September 23, 2008 Share Posted September 23, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £533.04 in Profit!!) I reckon i make a steady £100 to £150 a week by laying ' date=' only small wins but it all clearly adds up. Does that mean im gona get charged ? Im reckon ive touched 100 markets this week already and its only tuesday !![/quote'] The way I see it is that "steady drip" winners (like this thread -- see, it is relevant!) are likely to be charged, because (a) by their nature they use lots of markets and (b) they are likely to have lots of small wins with very few losses. If you keep winning 1% of your bank per bet and paying 5% commission on those wins but never ever lose, then your commission generated will only be a max of 5% of your net profit, and so you will be eligible for the premium charge. Say your net pre-commmission profits add up to £5,000 for the year, based on 1,000 bets winning £5 each and no losses, then your actual profit would be £4,750 (i.e. £5,000 less 5%), but BF would take the other £750 off to bring your commission level up to 20% of your profits. Result: actual profit of £4,000. (Actually, you would not pay the PC in the first 60 weeks because of the £1,000 allowance, but BF have not said this will continue after the first 60 weeks!) Whereas if you have what BF calls "a healthy mix" of profits and losses, the commission you pay on the winners will be a much bigger percentage of your net profits. Say you still make net pre-commission profits £5,000 in a year, but this is made up of wins of £15,000 and losses of £10,000. You will have paid £750 commission on the wins (meaning actual profit is only £4,250) and "generated" between £200 and £500 (depending on the matcher's commission rate) commission on the losses. So taking a ballpark figure as 4% commission for the matchers, you will have paid £1,350 on net profits of £5,000, so you won't be eligible for the PC. But notice how your actual profit is not all that much higher (£4,250 vs £4,000) because of the higher number of total wins and hence more commission paid overall. Confused yet? To sum up: under the old regime, the more winners you had the better, which may sound obvious, but the reason is that you only pay 5% commission if you win every bet, whereas if you have a mix of winners and losers, the commission is a higher percentage of the NET profits. Under the new regime, you would make more money by winning (say) £14,900 and losing £10,000 than you would by winning £5,000 and losing nothing. (This is ignoring the £1,000 allowance, which I can't see lasting). --------------- Actually I think I have spotted a flaw in my logic.... I think the "commission generated" calculation takes HALF of the commission you have paid on wins plus HALF of the commission paid by whoever matched your losing bets. This makes sense because otherwise BF are counting the same commission twice, once from each customer. I haven't got the T&Cs to hand but I'm pretty sure that is correct. So the actual sums above are not quite correct, but the basic message is the same! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Grim Reaper Posted September 23, 2008 Share Posted September 23, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £533.04 in Profit!!) Madness and im all confuddled !!! Over to the pruple one , PMSL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Grim Reaper Posted September 23, 2008 Share Posted September 23, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £533.04 in Profit!!) I thought the traders were the people they were trying to hit with the charges , but if your right then the traders who have lots and lots of losses , wont be hit ? They may do 50 bets per market and win say 5% profit heads totally frazzled !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mediamonkey Posted September 23, 2008 Share Posted September 23, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £533.04 in Profit!!) I thought the traders were the people they were trying to hit with the charges , but if your right then the traders who have lots and lots of losses , wont be hit ? They may do 50 bets per market and win say 5% profit heads totally frazzled !!! That's not how trading works! The idea is that you make lots of backs and lays within one market and (hopefully) come out with a profit overall. And BF only counts the overall position on each market, so 25 lays and 25 backs within one market, totalling to a small profit, will only count as one winning bet. Commission is paid on the overall profit on each market, not on each transaction -- if it was on each transaction, then trading would be near impossible. Good traders will have relatively few losses and lots of small wins. Therefore they are likely to be hit by the PC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyXS Posted October 1, 2008 Author Share Posted October 1, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £533.04 in Profit!!) I'm back!! Bet 74: Lay~ Bordeaux 3 - Roma 0 £516.71 @ 46/1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Grim Reaper Posted October 1, 2008 Share Posted October 1, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £533.04 in Profit!!) I fancy Bordeaux for this game tbh mate , the 3.20 at kickoff is ridiculous !! Not lost at home in 25 games , diff team at home than away , and the 4-0 defeat was at Chelsea (the favs for the cup!!) .... Roma were awful at home to Cluj , and have been bad for a long time now , how they are favs is beyond me . Ive seen them numerous times and gone are the team of about 5 years ago who were attacking and scoring for fun and went so close to winning the scudetto . They are very average now at best imvho. Having said that , doubt they`ll get 3 , lol, french teams rarely get 2 nevermind me !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyXS Posted October 1, 2008 Author Share Posted October 1, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £533.04 in Profit!!) I fancy Bordeaux for this game tbh mate , the 3.20 at kickoff is ridiculous !! Not lost at home in 25 games , diff team at home than away , and the 4-0 defeat was at Chelsea (the favs for the cup!!) .... Roma were awful at home to Cluj , and have been bad for a long time now , how they are favs is beyond me . Ive seen them numerous times and gone are the team of about 5 years ago who were attacking and scoring for fun and went so close to winning the scudetto . They are very average now at best imvho. Having said that , doubt they`ll get 3 , lol, french teams rarely get 2 nevermind me !! Very good point. And the score is now 1-0 to Bordeaux :loon :hope This games not a goal-fest, althought Bordeaux have just had Souza sent off :clap Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyXS Posted October 1, 2008 Author Share Posted October 1, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £533.04 in Profit!!) 1-1 so bet is safe :clap Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyXS Posted October 1, 2008 Author Share Posted October 1, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £533.04 in Profit!!) Well I was right in the end about having faith in Roma - and good to see I continued where I left off :) Bet 74: WON final score Bordeaux 1 - Roma 3 Won: £11.48 Means new balance to bet: £522.45 Banked: £272.07 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyXS Posted October 2, 2008 Author Share Posted October 2, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £544.52 in Profit!!) Bet 75: Lay~ Motherwell 3 - Nancy 1 £522.45 @ 48/1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoopy08 Posted October 2, 2008 Share Posted October 2, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £544.52 in Profit!!) Good going mate, can i ask, how do you lay for less than £2 on betfair, was thinking of maybe giving this a go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Grim Reaper Posted October 2, 2008 Share Posted October 2, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £544.52 in Profit!!) Simple as you like mate , heres how !! pick your selection , say Guimares/pompey later 3-3 @ 100 Lay it , but put your odds at 1.01 , do that for £2.00 Then click on `my bets` and the bet comes up where you can change odds/stake and it will show 1.01 and £2.00 , now if say you want to lay 3-3 for 75p , change the £2.00 in the stake box to £2.75 and click submit . Then click my bets again , and you will now have 2 seperate bets , both at 1.01 , 1 for £2.00 and 1 for £0.75 . On the £0.75 bet , change the odds to 100 and click submit , bet gets matched and then cancel your £2.00 and bobs your mums brother Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoopy08 Posted October 2, 2008 Share Posted October 2, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £544.52 in Profit!!) Simple as you like mate , heres how !! pick your selection , say Guimares/pompey later 3-3 @ 100 Lay it , but put your odds at 1.01 , do that for £2.00 Then click on `my bets` and the bet comes up where you can change odds/stake and it will show 1.01 and £2.00 , now if say you want to lay 3-3 for 75p , change the £2.00 in the stake box to £2.75 and click submit . Then click my bets again , and you will now have 2 seperate bets , both at 1.01 , 1 for £2.00 and 1 for £0.75 . On the £0.75 bet , change the odds to 100 and click submit , bet gets matched and then cancel your £2.00 and bobs your mums brother Cheers mate will give that a try. :ok Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyXS Posted October 2, 2008 Author Share Posted October 2, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £544.52 in Profit!!) Bet 75: WON final score Motherwell 0 - Nancy 2 Won: £11.11 Means new balance to bet: £528.01 Banked: £277.62 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyXS Posted October 3, 2008 Author Share Posted October 3, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £555.63 in Profit!!) Bet 76: Lay~ Arminia Bielefeld 1 - Karlsruher 3 £528.01 @ 46/1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyXS Posted October 3, 2008 Author Share Posted October 3, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £555.63 in Profit!!) Turned out rather closer than Id expected, but still another tasty win!! :) Bet 76: WON final score Arminia Bielefeld 1 - Karlsruher 2 Won: £11.73 Means new balance to bet: £533.88 Banked: £283.48 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyXS Posted October 4, 2008 Author Share Posted October 4, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £567.36 in Profit!!) Bet 77: Lay~ Birmingham 1 - QPR 3 £533.88 @ 70/1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hooloovoo Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £567.36 in Profit!!) moving along nicely :ok Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyXS Posted October 4, 2008 Author Share Posted October 4, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £567.36 in Profit!!) Bet 78: Lay~ Sunderland 3 - Arsenal 2 (See below) @ 100/1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyXS Posted October 4, 2008 Author Share Posted October 4, 2008 Re: Scotty's 2nd Attacking Drip!! (Currently £567.36 in Profit!!) Bet 77: WON final score Birmingham 1 - QPR 0 Won: £7.73 Means new balance to bet: £537.75 Banked: £287.34 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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