GaF Posted June 1, 2007 Share Posted June 1, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person I also made some bad decisions with great hands: I took on an extremely tight player (Higoha) with AJo on a flop of AA7 (he bet into me and I went all in). He had p77. I beat myself up for two days over this, as I've shared so many tables with this player and time and time again I've told myself to be very careful when he starts betting. That's a very tough one to lay down ..... EVEN if you know his cards - you have a 23% chance of getting a higher FH ..... but the range of hands he could have raised you with ...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nade Posted June 1, 2007 Author Share Posted June 1, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person I have to say I'm fed up of PKR too. I think I'm going to take out the last of my money and move the rest to Full Tilt and start playing primarily Omaha Hi. Yeh i've withdrawn it all now and will concentrate on the ipoker network (paddypower/titan) but no limit hold'em. Don't see why you don't carry on with hold'em as you know your stuff very well imo :ok . And in the spirit of the thread... I barely broke even last month. The month before I doubled my BR :nana . This seemed to be the start of my probs, as it made me think I could beat the game at my chosen level (0.05/0.10 on Boss) and I started playing far too loose. Once I cottoned on to where I was going wrong, I cut right down on pf raises and tightened up so much that I got bluffed off a lot of hands. :sad I also made some bad decisions with great hands: I took on an extremely tight player (Higoha) with AJo on a flop of AA7 (he bet into me and I went all in). He had p77. I beat myself up for two days over this, as I've shared so many tables with this player and time and time again I've told myself to be very careful when he starts betting. In the last week, I've managed to get back on track and drag myself out of hole. I ended the month just over a buy-in up over last month. Nade, if you've been beating your game then you can do so again. ;) Have a break for a day or two and work out where YOU are going wrong (maybe you're not, but in hindsight I'm convinced there is more to MY 'bad beats' than just bad luck!). Good luck mate, you'll crack it :ok I like this self analytical approach where you can see the failings and work on improving it, it's what i've been doing a lot of when i played cash games on ipoker (PKR cash games are 100% different to normal poker so i had to adapt a whole new game there lol) Just gotta stay solid and work on the faults and hopefully we'll both get rid of these bad runs, GL Tom, and cheers for the info :ok Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crouch Potato Posted June 1, 2007 Share Posted June 1, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person Re the Omaha thing - I suck at making laydowns. I'm sure it's costing me a bunch. Omaha looks to be the best place to learn how to make laydowns and I think it'll help me improve my game, plus it seems pretty fun and has a bit of a different element to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nade Posted June 1, 2007 Author Share Posted June 1, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person Gone back to titan and played 4 $2 STT one level lower then normal and placed 3 out of 4 with two 3rds and one second with the other a 4th place and not a dodgy hand in sight :ok What's really bizarre is that i haven't won a HU in 5 attempts (either end of tournament or straight 1v1) and i was really great at them - even though i hadn't looked at one strategy re HU. I think it is possible to over-analyze the game at times and i need to try and rediscover my natural touch in these situations! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Hedonist Posted June 2, 2007 Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person I like this self analytical approach Standing in the shower helps :loon That's a very tough one to lay down ..... EVEN if you know his cards - you have a 23% chance of getting a higher FH ..... but the range of hands he could have raised you with ...... Believe me GAF, if it was against any other player I'd have only been p*ssed off :lol But after myself, I have more hands from this player in my PT db than any other. I clocked him as an extremely tight player a couple of months ago. Once he bet into me the alarm bells should have started ringing. Instead the dollar signs started flashing. :$ I'm not suggesting the player is unnbeatable, far from it. But I'd done a lot of homework on him, then completely ignored it when it came to the crunch = bad play :spank Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nade Posted June 2, 2007 Author Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person Obviously you didn't stand in the shower then ;) :( ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Hedonist Posted June 2, 2007 Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person Obviously you didn't stand in the shower then ;) :( ... Makes the laptop soggy! :lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
friskyfitz Posted June 2, 2007 Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person Nade.. Think about what Im about to say and then see.... Sitting on a $2/$4 table with $370 odd and dealt AA. Ive just raised $30 and had 4 callers. Flop 2,7, A (2,7 are spades) I have ACE spades. Check, check and I raise $50. One guy goes all in with 7,7 and pulled the fourth SEVEN and cost me $190. Im left with roughly $155 and next hand is KK. I have a raise of $25 before me. Im on Sm.B. I re-raise and go all in for $130 ish and he turns A,3o and flop is 2,5,4 ........... It only at these moments do you realise that you are completely fcuk......ed!! Im sick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidmphill Posted June 2, 2007 Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person Thats shocking to hear Frisky!:eek Makes me feel a whole lot better now though! Better luck in the future.:ok Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ Posted June 2, 2007 Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person yeah, I winced when I read that post. you'll come good I'm sure, don't chase. Go to bed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nade Posted June 2, 2007 Author Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person That's totally disgusting Frisky, feel for you big time :( I know the likes of GaF etc condemn any of this talk re. dodgy game engines but they do make you wonder sometimes and that is obviously another example. Having said that i've watched a load of live poker online and the beats can be just as bad for example kid poker flopping the nuts 4/5 times in high stakes poker and losing every time! :loon cost him 100's of k's. You'll come through those beats no doubt :ok Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nade Posted June 2, 2007 Author Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person Placed in another STT so that's 5/6 placings now but went out of a re-buy $1 very unluckily. Had QJ. flop comes 10s Jc 2s, short stack pushes all in i call, another fella goes allin i call, they turn over Q5 and 9,10 respectively. Turn 7d, river 8c go out to straight, couldn't be bothered to re-buy but i should be getting more luck in these MTT!! :cry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valiant23 Posted June 2, 2007 Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person Nade.. Think about what Im about to say and then see.... Sitting on a $2/$4 table with $370 odd and dealt AA. Ive just raised $30 and had 4 callers. Flop 2,7, A (2,7 are spades) I have ACE spades. Check, check and I raise $50. One guy goes all in with 7,7 and pulled the fourth SEVEN and cost me $190. Im left with roughly $155 and next hand is KK. I have a raise of $25 before me. Im on Sm.B. I re-raise and go all in for $130 ish and he turns A,3o and flop is 2,5,4 ........... It only at these moments do you realise that you are completely fcuk......ed!! Im sick Right, firstly when I opened this thread I expected to see a picture of me in post #1 because thats exactly how I feel when I've lost yet another race (last night in the Poker Player G.P. My AK vs KQ :eyes). Anyway, I've given up arguing with Gaf on this subject, mostly because he's right but I do have a different interpretation on bad beats, and that is this. A bed beat should be measured by how much the hand has cost you in psychological terms as much as in statistical terms which is why a player on a bad run has his misery compounded by each subsequent outdraw, to the extent that a 60/40 race that he loses has the same effect as a 98% losing to a 2% chance. Trying to emotionally detach yourself from the outcomes of any poker hand is crucial to your development as a player. Instead of getting cross at the software/site/donk play/dog the best approach has to be congratulating yourself on doing the right thing (at its basest I suppose thats getting your money in when you're ahead). I know Frisky will be pissed about losing with his KK to A3, but would he take the same race a hundred times? Of course he would. When you develop your emotional dettachment from any individual hand you will be better placed to analyse any hand, which in turn will help you accept that there is only so much that you have control over. If you have exercised your control correctly, there is nothing more you can do. I know that I am a fiery character and I do get upset sometimes and I react to these situations (to my shame) but I do believe I am getting better at dealing with this aspect of my game. My sg is there to remind me how I should deal with the 'bad beats'. Anyway... back to last night and MY bad beat story.............anyone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robilaruk Posted June 2, 2007 Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person POST OF THE DAY! :clap :clap :clap :clap Damo Right, firstly when I opened this thread I expected to see a picture of me in post #1 because thats exactly how I feel when I've lost yet another race (last night in the Poker Player G.P. My AK vs KQ :eyes). Anyway, I've given up arguing with Gaf on this subject, mostly because he's right but I do have a different interpretation on bad beats, and that is this. A bed beat should be measured by how much the hand has cost you in psychological terms as much as in statistical terms which is why a player on a bad run has his misery compounded by each subsequent outdraw, to the extent that a 60/40 race that he loses has the same effect as a 98% losing to a 2% chance. Trying to emotionally detach yourself from the outcomes of any poker hand is crucial to your development as a player. Instead of getting cross at the software/site/donk play/dog the best approach has to be congratulating yourself on doing the right thing (at its basest I suppose thats getting your money in when you're ahead). I know Frisky will be pissed about losing with his KK to A3, but would he take the same race a hundred times? Of course he would. When you develop your emotional dettachment from any individual hand you will be better placed to analyse any hand, which in turn will help you accept that there is only so much that you have control over. If you have exercised your control correctly, there is nothing more you can do. I know that I am a fiery character and I do get upset sometimes and I react to these situations (to my shame) but I do believe I am getting better at dealing with this aspect of my game. My sg is there to remind me how I should deal with the 'bad beats'. Anyway... back to last night and MY bad beat story.............anyone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nade Posted June 2, 2007 Author Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person Nice post Valiant but i got another v. bad beat just now which most likely cost me money in a sng. The SB had just been eliminated so there was just one blind who was also short stack and everyone folded to me acting last with AQs so i raise to 230 with blinds at 100 to tempt a call and he did. The flop comes Jd 7d As he pushes his last 580 thinking i was just attempting to blind steal PF but no, i call he turns over Q10o so he has nothing, the turn comes an 8.... the river a 9 - making him a straight and keeping him in and putting me below 1k. He ends up knocking me out in 5th whereas i would have been in the top 4 with a v healthy chip stack. What was even more frustrating is this guy saying he wasn't lucky and played it right! No justice at all for out-playing people at the moment. :eyes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GaF Posted June 2, 2007 Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person Great post Mr V - I think you've finally grasped it - we MIGHT make a poker player out of you yet :tongue2 :moon :moon :moon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GaF Posted June 2, 2007 Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person Nice post Valiant but i got another v. bad beat just now which most likely cost me money in a sng. You SHOULD get dozens EVERY day (assuming you're playing a moderate amount). When the money went in post flop he had about a 22% chance - that means that he WILL beat you once every 4 to 5 times ... you probably played not far off 4 or 5 shots like this during the STT? It is NORMAL to lose one of them..... That's why aggression is so valuable, and winning the blinds pre flop without a showdown - there is no chance of getting outdrawn.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nade Posted June 2, 2007 Author Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person If i want to complain GaF i will complain.:dude And BTW it was 82.12% v 17.87% and i didn't have 6/7 other showdowns like this in the tourn, in fact that was probably the first. ... :tongue2 And i just went out in 3rd with AQ v KQ in about my 3rd showdown of the tourn ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaded Posted June 2, 2007 Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person If i want to complain GaF i will complain.:dude And if those of us with some concept of odds want to keep pointing out that you're boring, we will. Edit: Sorry, not meant to sound QUITE that harsh - but I'm getting similar whines from EVERYBODY I beat in MTT's atm when I'm behind, and it's starting to get annoying... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nade Posted June 2, 2007 Author Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person And if those of us with some concept of odds want to keep pointing out that you're boring, we will. Edit: Sorry, not meant to sound QUITE that harsh - but I'm getting similar whines from EVERYBODY I beat in MTT's atm when I'm behind, and it's starting to get annoying... Sorry and i thought it was a forum where we could relay our own thoughts and feelings. I'm telling you what i'm encountering and that's it, if people want to reply or not that's your own choice like it's my choice to post in the first place. But we can just all agree with eachother and shut all the forums down on the web................ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaded Posted June 2, 2007 Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person Sorry and i thought it was a forum where we could relay our own thoughts and feelings. It is. My thoughts and feelings are that you're becoming boring, and would be far better off trying to get some idea of pot odds, which you've admitted you're not very good with, than whining so much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GaF Posted June 2, 2007 Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person Sorry and i thought it was a forum where we could relay our own thoughts and feelings. I'm telling you what i'm encountering and that's it' date=' if people want to reply or not that's your own choice like it's my choice to post in the first place. But we can just all agree with eachother and shut all the forums down on the web................[/quote'] Hey calm down everyone - why did this suddenly become less good humoured? Nade is expressing his opinion. I'm expressing my opinion. No issues are there? :loon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaded Posted June 2, 2007 Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person Apologies Nade - my personal feelings are that you WANT these guys to be making stupid plays, though; however I appreciate that it must be frustrating for you at the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nade Posted June 2, 2007 Author Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person It is. My thoughts and feelings are that you're becoming boring' date=' and would be far better off trying to get some idea of pot odds, which you've admitted you're not very good with, than whining so much.[/quote'] This is the 'poker chat' forum not the 'poker strategy' forum - i put this topic in here for a reason and that is for a good old fashioned rant, not to get advice like i said in the very first post so for experts like you there is no need to get involved and certainly not to get pissed off at a few comments which are as GaF said above 'in good humour'. I have asked numerous times for help with pot odds in the 'strategy' section and have had minimal help so perhaps you could give me some words of wisdom instead of going off on your own rant... :unsure Sorry GaF but i'm a very chatty person and like a good debate/argument :tongue2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GaF Posted June 2, 2007 Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person you WANT these guys to be making stupid plays' date='[/quote'] Agreed :ok Most of your profit in poker comes not from your superior abilities, but your opponents superior ineptitude - can't remember who said something similar - but it's spot on. I don't have an edge against players who dont make bad plays and put their money in when ahead rather than when behind.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GaF Posted June 2, 2007 Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person i put this topic in here for a reason and that is for a good old fashioned rant' date=' not to get advice [/quote'] We do have a thread specially for that - you can be pretty certain that not many people will read it there (and you certainly wont see me venture in there ;) ) :ok -http://www.punterslounge.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16842&highlight=bad+beat Sorry if that's the case :sad The problem we have in strategy are that there are lots and lots of hand histories posted and they take a lot of time to work through .... but then a very large proportion turn out to be "disguised" bad beat stories .... "I got all in pre flop with aces and was called by 23o who hit runner runner straight ... how could I have played the hand better and got away from it?" In all honesty, I dont read most hand histories now unless there is something specific in the players comments that tweaks my interest.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nade Posted June 2, 2007 Author Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person No worries GaF, and i did post a similar thing to the "got all in pre flop with aces and was called by 23o who hit runner runner straight ... how could I have played the hand better and got away from it?" myself but for genuine strategy help but i know you weren't aiming that at me btw ;) And i have no beef with anyone on here at all, i like criticism constructive or otherwise! :lol PS. Pretty much out of a SNG now about half way through after i limp with AQo UTG, get one re-raise i call flop comes 6xQ i bet he goes all-in i call he turns over 6Q and hits another 6 for a FH. Just relaying the facts lol......... (Back over 1k now btw :tongue2) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robilaruk Posted June 2, 2007 Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person I know this isn't the strategy thread however, limping AQ is fine, but how much was the raise? its limping and calling with marginal hands that might be contributing to the bad beats? If you intended to reraise AI if raised then that would be a better play IMHO then simply calling and hoping to hit Just a thought Damo PS. Pretty much out of a SNG now about half way through after i limp with AQo UTG, get one re-raise i call flop comes 6xQ i bet he goes all-in i call he turns over 6Q and hits another 6 for a FH. Just relaying the facts lol......... (Back over 1k now btw :tongue2) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robilaruk Posted June 2, 2007 Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person I too have noticed that. (BTW there is no better way to play Aces then get you chips in whilst ahead!) I don't think you can discuss general strategy with PF AI's unless it is should I shove AI? should I call the AI?they would be more interesting for me - what is the shoving range and calling range we should be trying to get to to maximise EV Damo Sorry if that's the case :sad The problem we have in strategy are that there are lots and lots of hand histories posted and they take a lot of time to work through .... but then a very large proportion turn out to be "disguised" bad beat stories .... "I got all in pre flop with aces and was called by 23o who hit runner runner straight ... how could I have played the hand better and got away from it?" In all honesty, I dont read most hand histories now unless there is something specific in the players comments that tweaks my interest.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nade Posted June 2, 2007 Author Share Posted June 2, 2007 Re: The most unlucky person I know this isn't the strategy thread however, limping AQ is fine, but how much was the raise? its limping and calling with marginal hands that might be contributing to the bad beats? If you intended to reraise AI if raised then that would be a better play IMHO then simply calling and hoping to hit Just a thought Damo At this point in the SNG i was playing uber tight thus limping with 100 call and the raise was another 100 so my thoughts were for just another 100 i can see the flop and get away cheaply if i miss but go in hard if i hit. It's an interesting thought re. bad beats coming by limping then calling, i see the logic as if i limp they think i'm weak so push with lesser hands then i show the power but lose the race as it were, not sure if that's happend tbh, would be a job searching through all the hands, but is something i'll consider, cheers :) I'd love to know the odds of losing all-ins with A3o(27%) against AQo(73%) then losing with A10s (72%) v A3o(28%) because that happened to me tonight within 3hands :\ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.