Wolverhampton Declare FOURTEEN race card on Saturday

[south_eastern_ram]

Re: Wolverhampton Declare FOURTEEN race card on Saturday Get the boss onto this. Paul should be able to get an answer out of them surely?

[The Saint]

Re: Wolverhampton Declare FOURTEEN race card on Saturday

Get the boss onto this. Paul should be able to get an answer out of them surely?

There is a clear conflict of interests though - If I were Paul, I certainly wouldn't want to be taking the dicks to task over this considering how much they advertise on PL. It would be nice to get Matt Chapman and the like on the case but at the end of the day, we need them and they need us and I can't imagine how much dross they have to read through on ATR... It's unlikely the first person to read an e-mail would even understand what the problem was!!! Wouldn't it be refreshing if a Bookmaker came on to offer an explanation though. Coral were a bit slow!! They hacked it in 9 minutes after they were informed it was a NR!!! Absolute joke - who ya gonna tell tho!? In an industry where everyone is in bed with everyone else which is surrounded by cloak and dagger which about 0.000000000000000000000000000000001% of the population really understands one feels it would be like banging your head against a brick wall!!! :wall It is a disgrace though - I mean how many 1000s of punters will be unaware they have been, in affect, robbed today - I mean if Forest Edge goes in it is likely to be £1,000s saved from their greedy satchels....

[fintron]

Re: Wolverhampton Declare FOURTEEN race card on Saturday That's the thing, who do you tell? I have little faith in IBAS and the media are all in bed with the bookies. Maybe we should ring dom from that rogue traders programme!

[chris34]

Re: Wolverhampton Declare FOURTEEN race card on Saturday

Isn't it a rearranged Southwell midweek card from a week or so ago?

Nope this was a rare Southwell Saturday card (they have a couple when Lingfield dont race on Saturdays this time of year) All the meetings from Southwell have been transferred to other courses on same days

[mowgli77]

Re: Wolverhampton Declare FOURTEEN race card on Saturday

That's the thing' date=' who do you tell? I have little faith in IBAS and the media are all in bed with the bookies. Maybe we should ring dom from that rogue traders programme![/quote'] I've just posted this thread on Matt Chapman's facebook wall, see if he will get this highlighted. I'm going to email Racing UK and write to the Racing Post too. This is something Whoneedsrio highlighted a few weeks ago when they shortened his non runner and stung him for a rule 4 and it actually tipped over from a 5p rule 4 to a 10p rule 4 that day I think. Plain theft, shortening a horse you know won't run.

[mowgli77]

Re: Wolverhampton Declare FOURTEEN race card on Saturday Sent Bruce Millington a tweet on twitter to mention it too and created a hashtag of #rule4robbery

[The Saint]

Sent Bruce Millington a tweet on twitter to mention it too and created a hashtag of #rule4robbery

Good Man!! I'd love to think it would be aired publicly somewhere.... They need to be named and shamed... Save me a place on The Morning Line!!!! ;)

[mowgli77]

Re: Wolverhampton Declare FOURTEEN race card on Saturday

Good Man!! I'd love to think it would be aired publicly somewhere.... They need to be named and shamed... Save me a place on The Morning Line!!!! ;)

He has replied and said they'll look into it. They won't have no choice when I've bombarded every bloody racing thing known to man about the topic. These need to be highlighted so I can give examples. I'll contact Whoneedsrio in a minute and see if he can remember the horse that they did it to with him, pretty sure it tipped a 5p rule 4 to a 10p rule 4, robbing bassas.

[mowgli77]

Re: Wolverhampton Declare FOURTEEN race card on Saturday

Good Man!! I'd love to think it would be aired publicly somewhere.... They need to be named and shamed... Save me a place on The Morning Line!!!! ;)

He has said he noted one last month and they did a bit on it. Let's hope this gets addressed properly. If enough of us shout, whinge, moan and bitch they can't just ignore us.

[The Saint]

He has said he noted one last month and they did a bit on it. Let's hope this gets addressed properly. If enough of us shout' date=' whinge, moan and bitch they can't just ignore us.[/quote'] And Forest Edge went in so they (if our evidence is correct) stole the maximum amount possible.... The Little Monkeys!!!

[RIO2014]

Re: Wolverhampton Declare FOURTEEN race card on Saturday Only just gone thru this thread again, I mentioned yesterday that I have seen this kind of skullduggery on a constant basis for the last 2 years, My only surprise is that no one has brought it up on these pages sooner. As i have said before they hold all the keys, they pay the bills, especially so with their advertising, so getting ATR to bring the subject up, I think QPR have more chance of winning the PL. And to be fair to the owner of this site, he is caught between a rock and a hard place. BOOKMAKERS are not the bookmakers of old, every penny will be generated under any circumstance. I have a personal hatered for BETFRED/TOTESPORT, the placepot n jackpot is being raped by this firm, like you would never have imagined. They are responsible for the worst of all,,, false advertising with the prices. And here is something else they are guilty of and as far as i know stand alone... As a show is changing if a horse is drifting, say 5/2 to 11/4....the majority of books, will change it within seconds, Not good old Fred, they will hold it for at least 30 seconds, so those not sharp, will hopefully take 5/2, but if it shortens,,, its in the blink of an eye. Every chance i get , i will try and get money of this lot, I will drive around 20 shops if i have to to get small bets on. Just for a victory, and you have to get around with this lot, because on the rare occasion you may get better odds....To quote, Barney, you will struggle to get 2 bananas to 1, with good old Fred.

[fintron]

Re: Wolverhampton Declare FOURTEEN race card on Saturday

Saint, I think if they get a self cert they aren't allowed to race for the next week.......but don't quote me on it. Rules for nr's on account of travel/ground etc are different.

Saint, just found reference to the rule i referred to for the self certs.... "In accordance with Rule (F)96, the British Horseracing Authority will suspend the horse from running in Great Britain for 6 days commencing on the day following the day of the race." ...I dunno what was going on with that Redcar one earlier!

[The Saint]

Saint, just found reference to the rule i referred to for the self certs.... "In accordance with Rule (F)96, the British Horseracing Authority will suspend the horse from running in Great Britain for 6 days commencing on the day following the day of the race." ...I dunno what was going on with that Redcar one earlier!

Makes the Aubritia example even more sust because they must have got a vet to agree he had a bruised/pricked foot and then ran her the next day anyway!! It's there in B&W! Thanks for finding that out m8

[jayalexander]

Re: Wolverhampton Declare FOURTEEN race card on Saturday Jeez, I was on Forest Edge yesterday. The last leg in a L15 and the only winner, so twice the odds. Never thought nothing about the highlighted issue other than 'it's one of those things' but have just checked now and there seems to be a 40p R4 for me! Bet placed at 11:13 and Forest Edge was 10/3 at the time. Scandulous activities by the bookies...

[Smarty72]

Re: Wolverhampton Declare FOURTEEN race card on Saturday An example of bookmakers greed is William Hill offering 33\1 for Cristal Bonus for the King George. All other bookie have taken it out of there lists.

[whoneedsrio]

Re: Wolverhampton Declare FOURTEEN race card on Saturday I've been in touch with Mowgli with regard to the scam of shortening up the non runners, there were actually two. The first one was in July & I mentioned it in my thread at the time, I'd backed one at Thirsk before I went to the track & there ended up being three non runners. One was an outsider so no R4, another was taken out after racing started with a price of around 5/1 so a R4 of 15p which I have no problem with. The third had been declared a non runner at 11.10 according to Oddschecker, at 11.04 Hills had cut it to 9/1 while everybody else had it at 11/1 or 12/1 moving the R4 to 10p from 5p. I suppose it could have been a coincidence but I smelt a rat, however it would have been hard to prove. The other one was a few weeks ago & I highlighted it in Fintron's "Sick of being raped by the bookies thread" I was going to Doncaster on the last Friday in October so Thurday night I'm looking at the card on the Racing Post site, this was around 5.30pm. They had the Noseda trained Livery down as doubtful in the 3.50 which usually means it's not going to run. A check on the Timeform site which has a Betfair link had it down has a non runner, however all the bookies on Oddchecker had it running & all bar two or three had cut it from 9/2 to 4/1 which again is just enough to shift the R4 from 15p to 20p. I checked the BHA site & it had been taken out at 4.43pm, now I suppose you could say that I'm looking at 5.30 so that's less than an hour but I checked again around 11pm just before going to bed & it was still in all the lists as a runner. I hadn't backed anything at that point but how many backed the winner & were stiffed out of 5p in the pound? On a different point it's well known that the on course bookies can do what they like & that the place terms on offer at the big meetings & Saturdays are not what they should be but I was at Catterick on Wednesday the other week & two boards were going a sixth for the place in the first race which was a 16 runner handicap!!!!! It stinks & it's time it was sorted. Rio.

[jayalexander]

Re: Wolverhampton Declare FOURTEEN race card on Saturday I'm sure someone mentioned on here that one on course bookie was offering 1/8 in some race, not sure of the amount of runners and he had a go at the bloke. Wouldn't have bothered me, I'd have just gone to another one and I bet to win 99 times out of 100 anyway. But people are right, it's nothing short of theft. The bookies not taking a non runner out till they shorten it are acting fraudulently. I'm sure there are enough people on this forum to kick up enough of a fuss to get something done about it.

[NeilM]

I have to confess its not something I've come across during my time in the industry but looking at it now it does seem apparent- it would be interesting to see if the exchange prices shifted dramatically before a withdrawal as well. Keeping a day-by-day record may be interesting for a few weeks: certainly keeping a horse in after withdrawal the night before stinks to high heaven.

[fintron]

Re: Wolverhampton Declare FOURTEEN race card on Saturday

it would be interesting to see if the exchange prices shifted dramatically before a withdrawal as well.

It would be interesting to see, yeah, but I doubt the same would happen in the same way we seem to be seeing with the bookies. The reason being that Betfair makes more money by taking commission out of winnings. Say the exchanges matches up two punters wanting to trade Borderlescott at 11.00 to a £100 stake, they'd get £5 off the 'back' punter if the horse wins. If the horse loses they still take 5 % off the 'lay' punter and take the same amount of commission (assuming standard commission). But if there was, say, a 20 % reductation factor, the horse is effectively 9.00, they'd only get £4.50 off the winning backer etc. So it wouldn't be in the interests of an exchange to drive down prices before pulling a horse out, if anything, they want the prices to drift out before applying the RF. With the bookies, however, taking an extra 5p in the £1 off wins could make a fair bit of difference, cumulatively. Punters up and down the country backing everything else in the same race, and all of those in multiples, where an extra 5p off a punter who has £500 rolling onto a 10/1 shot in an acca could mean paying out several hundred or even a few grand less to that punter?

[NeilM]

Absolutely. What I mean is looking at the exchanges to see if the prices on another runner shorten just before which would suggest people are getting on that in readiness as the reduction factor is not as much as the (too high IMHO) Rule 4 deductions. I doubt the exchanges would do it because of what you say but perhaps they'd do it on their fixed odds offering? Depending on where you were in the acca you could be looking at thousands. I personally did a Lucky 31 (I know, I know) the day before my birthday this year, the same day as the Lincoln and the big races in Dubai. Got absolutely destroyed by a set of cumulative rule 4s. Partly made up for it with an SP trixie and with assorted doubles at Donny the next day but very frustrating.

[NeilM]

This just got mentioned on ATR and apparently doesn't happen. I think they're focussing on the under orders/in the stalls issue rather than deductions on early prices by individual bookies.