Each Way Single Bets - A New Generation Of Betting?

[White Feather]

Please note what I have written are my own thoughts and opinions, this has no bearing on how PL community place their bets.

 

I have been betting horses since early 1970s and my intentions when putting any single bets on was for my horse to win as I would be disappointed like any other punter if it loses or placed.

 

Over the years I know notice that a number of pundits are advising on placing an each way single on a horse trading between 5/1 -11/2 (sometimes shorter), if the 5/1 shot is placed then odds become a lot shorter as we know and you now have 11/10  - ¼ odds say (excuse my sums). Now do we double our stakes? Or do we half our stake? In my opinion my returns would be very short and that's were I would be placing a single bet and hope for a winner.

 

Our resident tipster "The Brigadier" suggests in some races, each way single bets at 5/1 - 11/2 - now is that aimed at "big hitters" or punters like myself - "Fivers and  Tenners"? The ITV racing team such like, Matt Chapman and Adele Mulrennan put up 5/1 - 11/2 shots each way - now is this to help their tipping record for over the season? I would ask The Brigadier the same question?

 

My bets mostly on a Saturday or televised races midweek such as Royal Ascot , Cheltenham festival etc, are all single bets and I will choose two double figure odds for each way double and probably put a Lucky 15 on.

 

I have never been involved in any type of forum before but I would be grateful for all your thoughts   and if  you think I am still in the "dark ages" then please give me your insight as what works for you?

[LEE-GRAYS]

47 minutes ago, White Feather said:

Please note what I have written are my own thoughts and opinions, this has no bearing on how PL community place their bets.

 

I have been betting horses since early 1970s and my intentions when putting any single bets on was for my horse to win as I would be disappointed like any other punter if it loses or placed.

 

Over the years I know notice that a number of pundits are advising on placing an each way single on a horse trading between 5/1 -11/2 (sometimes shorter), if the 5/1 shot is placed then odds become a lot shorter as we know and you now have 11/10  - ¼ odds say (excuse my sums). Now do we double our stakes? Or do we half our stake? In my opinion my returns would be very short and that's were I would be placing a single bet and hope for a winner.

 

Our resident tipster "The Brigadier" suggests in some races, each way single bets at 5/1 - 11/2 - now is that aimed at "big hitters" or punters like myself - "Fivers and  Tenners"? The ITV racing team such like, Matt Chapman and Adele Mulrennan put up 5/1 - 11/2 shots each way - now is this to help their tipping record for over the season? I would ask The Brigadier the same question?

 

My bets mostly on a Saturday or televised races midweek such as Royal Ascot , Cheltenham festival etc, are all single bets and I will choose two double figure odds for each way double and probably put a Lucky 15 on.

 

I have never been involved in any type of forum before but I would be grateful for all your thoughts   and if  you think I am still in the "dark ages" then please give me your insight as what works for you?

I suppose doing e/w on 5/1 shots or 4/1 are in theory got lot more chance of winning than 10/1 and over but lot more probability of a place which gives you another chance to hit a winner and a small profit just keeps you going longer 👍

[Bang on]

It's a constant conundrum. Some time ago I asked myself a similar question.

My thoughts were that If betting WIN ONLY - you may require a 50pt betting bank, but if you were betting EACH WAY, you would get a return more often so maybe a 25pt bank would work.

Now, the maths ... a £1,000  bank divided by 50pts for WIN ONLY would be £20 WIN x 50. - BUT if betting EACH WAY and only having a 25pt bank, you would be staking £40 per bet (£20 EW) .. meaning that you are still betting £20 WIN but also with a £20 place saver.

-------------------------------

Of course, there is also  an alternative £40 bet .. that which involves 2 x £20 WIN bets in the same race giving you 2 chances and again, more regular returns as with 2 running for you, you should find a few more winners. It's an interesting debate for sure.

[Brahmin]

@LEE-GRAYS  agree with you...... if i bet daily then i will lose. i dont, as play the long game each month, so 8 runners then a 5-1+ returns my stake if placed to fight another day. if 7 runners then will split stake and back 2 to win. will be interested to see some other replies from serious / knowledgeable guys on here..... Brigadier / Zilzalian / MC Clarke / Richard westwood /  blackrabbit etc..............

ps..... from Mrs Brahmin Lee, had great hols and how the Allotment! 😂

 

[LEE-GRAYS]

43 minutes ago, Brahmin said:

@LEE-GRAYS  agree with you...... if i bet daily then i will lose. i dont, as play the long game each month, so 8 runners then a 5-1+ returns my stake if placed to fight another day. if 7 runners then will split stake and back 2 to win. will be interested to see some other replies from serious / knowledgeable guys on here..... Brigadier / Zilzalian / MC Clarke / Richard westwood /  blackrabbit etc..............

ps..... from Mrs Brahmin Lee, had great hols and how the Allotment! 😂

 

Agree glad yous had a good holiday bit wet up allotment but got good fire in community cabin for winter carole on the beer 😂

[richard-westwood]

My general rule is back Ew if 1/5 th odds 11/2 or win below ....that way you make a profit overall even if the horse only place ....at 5/1 you break even so that's not a bad bet .....below 5/1 you start losing money overall if the horse places so I'd rather invest in the win but sometimes the safety factor is nice ...it's personal choice 

[MCLARKE]

Some of my best bets have been each way where extra places are available, sadly I have less opportunities these days as I can't bet with most bookies.

Generally, if you can get the best odds with a bookie offering extra places then I would bet each way.

The best opportunities are in the big handicaps of 16+ runners where there are usually bookies offering 5,6 or more places.

The actual odds are irrelevant if you are looking at long term profits. I would back horses under 5/1 each way if there were extra places.

[Tedthewolf]

This very topic pops up every so often over the years was trying to find some old threads to post as we have had some great discussions & knowledgeable guys on here over the years   (i wish a lot of them were still around  i really do)  here but sadly  can't  find the threads maybe somebody  can i ain't great on computers!!!

Anyway from memory it was pretty split most likely  be similar this time around  some  were saying win bets only some e/w any price  and others like myself 4/1  (@1/4 odds) 5/1 (@ 1/5 odds) that or above  each way. I guess it's a personal choice and what works for you. 

Edited October 20, 2023 by Tedthewolf

[harrisman]

It's absolutely worth looking for the extra places in big field handicaps.Ive got a couple of files tucked away which annoyingly cant locate basically showing once you are over 12 runners , 16 runners etc with extra places then the ew value is big in your favour.Get 3 placed and maybe one winner in a treble the odds lucky 15 at odds even as low as 4/1 and you will get a reasonable return. 

On a similar subject re places I like the extra places for less odds you can do at Hills on the SSBT's. Interestingly if you back early in the day for example in a 6 runner race if it goes down to 5 runners by off time you are still paid for 3rd place if you backed it ew at the earlier times. Not sure if this is the same as online as Hills 

[Zilzalian]

Personally i am very anti ew bets i think they are a total rip off. I only ever "contemplate" them on multiples, Lucky 15's etc. or the occasional 33/1+ shots to larger (£40+) stakes.

£2 win at 20/1 horse wins £40 profit.

£1 ew  at 20/1 horse wins £24 profit.

£1 ew  at 20/1 horse plc's £03 profit.

My accounts show that if i did ew singles i would lose money over the year assuming i split my stakes. I would rather do a Reverse forecast with the place stake to be honest.

Now having said that each to their own, people have different ways of betting and it may well suit some people and how they bet but losing out on £17 (£1ew on 20/1 shot) if your horse wins just doesn't sit well with me to be honest.

[Brahmin]

On 10/19/2023 at 2:32 PM, LEE-GRAYS said:

Agree glad yous had a good holiday bit wet up allotment but got good fire in community cabin for winter carole on the beer 😂

Hiya Lee, Its 'tanned lady' who back from her Birthday hols and love the photos 😘 ..........  wow thats one of your sheds.  we have a glass topped large coffee table identical to yours in our lounge with candles and you have one in your allotment cubbyhole 😂.........anyway after bombing out on our Daily Naps in the sunshine, we hit today with 12/1 EW winner sooo be close to the top 25 now i would think 🤞 🐎.......but more importantly both our accounts look very healthy, as hubby backed at Redcar the easterbys this aft as his golf day was washed out.......with 3 nice winners @ 16/1 EW & 14/1 EW & Daily Nap sooooo made over £300 and  its Indian takeout tonite 🍺🍷🍛........

as for tomorrow at Ascot know hubby likes a couple but will see what ground / NRs are before laying out money!

[LEE-GRAYS]

1 hour ago, Brahmin said:

Hiya Lee, Its 'tanned lady' who back from her Birthday hols and love the photos 😘 ..........  wow thats one of your sheds.  we have a glass topped large coffee table identical to yours in our lounge with candles and you have one in your allotment cubbyhole 😂.........anyway after bombing out on our Daily Naps in the sunshine, we hit today with 12/1 EW winner sooo be close to the top 25 now i would think 🤞 🐎.......but more importantly both our accounts look very healthy, as hubby backed at Redcar the easterbys this aft as his golf day was washed out.......with 3 nice winners @ 16/1 EW & 14/1 EW & Daily Nap sooooo made over £300 and  its Indian takeout tonite 🍺🍷🍛........

as for tomorrow at Ascot know hubby likes a couple but will see what ground / NRs are before laying out money!

Nice winners hope my luck turns soon 😂👍

[MCLARKE]

13 hours ago, Zilzalian said:

Personally i am very anti ew bets i think they are a total rip off.

It all depends on the number of runners, the number of places and the place terms.

Assuming no overround then in a 16 runner handicap the expected return from betting to win would be 0 but for each way it would be 9%.

Increase the number of places to 5 (but reduce the each way terms from 1/4 to 1/5) and the return increases to 13%.