The Road to Ruin...

[hebert10]

Have been meaning to start a thread for a while on this but wanted to build up a bit of a bankroll before starting it. After building myself a decent little roll through Tourneys and (getting lucky in) cash games and finally binking a live tourney last week I've finally decided to give this a shot. Starting with a $1k Bankroll by the end of 2013 I would like to achieve... {} An ROI of over 10% (Basically prove to myself I can be a winning player) {} Stick to a strict(ish) BRM :unsure (100BI, will be altered as bankroll changes) {} Try to put in good volume around work {} Read-Watch-Learn whenever possible (Any tourney tips be well appreciated however much experience, you can never know enough about poker!) {} Get a big score :notworthy {} Stop playing whenever tired, on tilt or losing interest! {}Win A few Tourneys (3 Wins so Far) I might add more or alter these as the year goes on but we'll see how things go. Will keep updated here in here as much as possible! Let the journey begin.....

[teaulc]

Re: The Road to Ruin... good luck mate

[Washman]

Re: The Road to Ruin... Good luck hebert :hope

[Bart(UK)]

Re: The Road to Ruin... Good luck Heb. :ok

[hebert10]

Re: The Road to Ruin... Cheers guys :ok Couldn't of had a better start to be honest, played 3 tourneys tonight and 2 cashes. Going to post some results just in case things go downhill least i'll have this to look back on!:lol Hopefully onwards and upwards from here with the micro millions starting tomorrow! Bankroll: $1224.41

[Burnley Joe]

Re: The Road to Ruin... Good luck

[hebert10]

Re: The Road to Ruin... Quick update Will need to play alot more before I can start to see some proper results but I'm happy with how i'm playing at the moment feeling confident in every tourney I go in to. Should get a good few in this weekend, hoping to get a deep run in the micromillions aswel :notworthy Bankroll: $1188.15

[glceud]

Re: The Road to Ruin... Don't know how you are recording your records, but am suprised to that more people dont think the number of runners in a tourney is not an important factor.Wouldn't go as far as to say I am better at HU sit and go's than the Sunday storm but you get the gist. All the best with this, pretty sure you can do it.

[hebert10]

Re: The Road to Ruin...

Don't know how you are recording your records, but am suprised to that more people dont think the number of runners in a tourney is not an important factor.Wouldn't go as far as to say I am better at HU sit and go's than the Sunday storm but you get the gist. All the best with this, pretty sure you can do it.

I use poker score mate, means I input my own results. It's nowhere near as good as PT or HEM etc. but it takes up alot less memory and keeps the laptop from lagging, if/when I get a new comp Ill start using PT (I do have it but laptop isn't the greatest and it freezes alot). In terms of tourney selection I try to mix it up a bit to stop boredom setting in but usually only go for tournaments I think i'll have an edge in I look for things like number of players, type of tourney, value, Time. I'll normally only play tourneys with 500+ players if it's a big tourney and these are more of a shot than anything like the Sunday Storm. I've thought about grinding 45's or 90's but I want to keep the fun aspect in this aswel and not just a full on grind. I do see what you mean though my variance is going to be alot higher than if I played smaller MTT's. What kind of ROI do you think would be possible/achievable for an MTT player in relation to playing 0-500 man tourneys?

[glceud]

Re: The Road to Ruin... According to people that know a lot more than me about ROI than me you need to play about 50k tournies to account for variance. I use the 5 free sharkscope searches from time to time out of curiosity to see if players are as good or as bad as I suspect. Over a 100% is possible without any major wins changing the ROI over 5k games. One of the better players I know has a ROI of 56% over 4k games but take away 2 bigger scores and thats down to about 15%. Second thoughts cancel all that as I don't know average field size Question was more out of curiosity about your game as you do seem to run deep in large fields more than most people. With no evidence what so ever to back me up, I think most of the biggest online mtt winners have the ability to consistantly run deep in large fields.

[hebert10]

Re: The Road to Ruin...

According to people that know a lot more than me about ROI than me you need to play about 50k tournies to account for variance. I use the 5 free sharkscope searches from time to time out of curiosity to see if players are as good or as bad as I suspect. Over a 100% is possible without any major wins changing the ROI over 5k games. One of the better players I know has a ROI of 56% over 4k games but take away 2 bigger scores and thats down to about 15%. Second thoughts cancel all that as I don't know average field size Question was more out of curiosity about your game as you do seem to run deep in large fields more than most people. With no evidence what so ever to back me up, I think most of the biggest online mtt winners have the ability to consistantly run deep in large fields.

I know what you mean with the '1 win can change everything', that's the thing with MTT's and what most people seem to chase. I'm taking a fairly different approach through if I can keep playing within my bankroll and consistently playing well I should be able to grow it slowly as the more tourneys I play I can only get better (hopefully) through seeing more situations and analysing them. With regards to running deep I try to make sure I can get as large a stack as possible heading in to the money as I see no point in min cashing as it just makes playing a tournament a waste of time for me. I play to win in every tournament which sometimes sees me go a while without cashing at all, but when I do I usually manage to get myself in to a decent position with a chance of winning. Will take me a while to get a decent enough sample size since starting to take poker seriously, but I think stats from how I used to play a couple of years ago could work in my favour (complete donk btw :unsure) as other players will think i'm alot weaker. This would be alot easier if I could just bink the Sunday Million though :lol

[Danshot]

Re: The Road to Ruin... Good luck with this , I have previously tried to run a all be it smaller bankroll thread and ultimately lost the fun factor which you mentioned is key and tilted it all away. Do you stick to No Limit Holdem or you like a few other games as well? My stats have been going for awhile a be fair to say my MTT stats and Cash Game stats are awful though recently been trying to show my partner how to play my results have improved so thinking might take your lead and set my own thread again using some of your aims.

[hebert10]

Re: The Road to Ruin...

Good luck with this , I have previously tried to run a all be it smaller bankroll thread and ultimately lost the fun factor which you mentioned is key and tilted it all away. Do you stick to No Limit Holdem or you like a few other games as well? My stats have been going for awhile a be fair to say my MTT stats and Cash Game stats are awful though recently been trying to show my partner how to play my results have improved so thinking might take your lead and set my own thread again using some of your aims.

Thanks mate! I do play other games sometimes but the one I always stay away from is Omaha just never really got in to it. It's just harder to find tourneys for other games so I normally only play them in the big events like the micromillions. What about you? Yeah I think making a challenge for yourself is good as the support and tips along the way could really help. I played as a bad player for far too long I think it's about time I make some of that money back :lol Would be good to see you start a thread aswel mate, start with a set bankroll and set some goals. It will keep you motivated and hopefully help with the tilt/boredom :ok

[Danshot]

Re: The Road to Ruin... I like badugi and 2-7 draw games but like you said there can be a be thin on the ground MTT wise. I used to be able to concentrate on Heads Up games but I played hyper turbo's way out of my Bankroll because it gave that immediate fix but it also gets me tilted quickest so trying to figure out some more guidelines to my play. In the past played everything and anything maybe over estimated my ability in poker. Yesterday I tried out the new Irish Holdem games on Full Tilt and these seemed pretty good I defo run plus EV winning $30 in just 500 hands at 2c/5c but nothing beats the excitement of getting deep in a MTT.

[hebert10]

Re: The Road to Ruin...

I like badugi and 2-7 draw games but like you said there can be a be thin on the ground MTT wise. I used to be able to concentrate on Heads Up games but I played hyper turbo's way out of my Bankroll because it gave that immediate fix but it also gets me tilted quickest so trying to figure out some more guidelines to my play. In the past played everything and anything maybe over estimated my ability in poker. Yesterday I tried out the new Irish Holdem games on Full Tilt and these seemed pretty good I defo run plus EV winning $30 in just 500 hands at 2c/5c but nothing beats the excitement of getting deep in a MTT.

Yeah I like Badugi not played in a while though, prefer a bit of Stud. I think Hyper turbos are the biggest trap for players, the players who profit most at these seem to be super aggro grinders who have been playing for a few years. I think I'm personally better with a Deep and long blind structure as it gives me more time for post flop play and to build up a bit of a stack. I think I am getting better at turbos though as I play more and get better aggressively, normally I'm more of a TAG kind of player. I was the same in playing anything, I didn't care about BR or what kind of tourney I played in I just played to win big and ended up losing alot more than i thought at the time. After thinking about it though and going through the internet finding stuff I thought why not? theres no reason I can't profit in Poker, I'm not saying I'm gonna go pro but I still think a bit of money on the sides achievable. Do you play a bit of cash aswel? I started another thread in here called 'the quest for profit' when I started to get back in to poker, I made a little bit and was winning, but the grind bored me completely. I've always been a tourney player in all honesty (mostly a bad one ha), I think it's the challenge of beating all those other players to 1st place. Seen that Irish poker, haven't had a game yet though..isn't it like a mix between omaha/holdem?

[south_eastern_ram]

Re: The Road to Ruin... Good luck pal My advice on how to improve, read twoplustwo forum as much as possible. Such a sick place to learn imo, just reading through tournament hands people post up and reading peoples opinions has helped me improve loads. Not just from what they say, but the points they bring up that make you think about your own game. You get some of the best players in the world posting on there, foolish to ignore the things they say.

[hebert10]

Re: The Road to Ruin...

Good luck pal My advice on how to improve, read twoplustwo forum as much as possible. Such a sick place to learn imo, just reading through tournament hands people post up and reading peoples opinions has helped me improve loads. Not just from what they say, but the points they bring up that make you think about your own game. You get some of the best players in the world posting on there, foolish to ignore the things they say.

Cheers mate :ok I have been reading alot on there lately, some top players on there. Have been spending time just looking through sites most of it's the same but you do come accross the odd article that really makes you think and really helps.

[ashj22]

Re: The Road to Ruin... gl with the challenge.

[luckboxnemo]

Re: The Road to Ruin...

Don't know how you are recording your records, but am suprised to that more people dont think the number of runners in a tourney is not an important factor.Wouldn't go as far as to say I am better at HU sit and go's than the Sunday storm but you get the gist. All the best with this, pretty sure you can do it.

agree with this lose total interest sometimes in a mtt as it has loads of runners in it and make costly mistakes trying to double up early instead should be playing with a little more patience and focus gl mate

[hebert10]

Re: The Road to Ruin... Another update only 45 tourneys played but fairly pleased with the start could be better but of course could be alot worse! Will try to play a bit in the week but could be tough around work, going to try and get a bit of reading in aswel.

[hebert10]

Re: The Road to Ruin... Stuff like this is happening way to much lately! #Game No : 463996418 ***** Cassava Hand History for Game 463996418 ***** $25/$50 Blinds No Limit Holdem - *** Tournament #46281412 $5.45 + $0.55 - Table #9 (Real Money) Seat 2 is the button Total number of players : 8 Seat 1: shinyone ( $2,740 ) Seat 2: czatol07 ( $1,710 ) Seat 3: olbert66 ( $3,418 ) Seat 4: llinutee ( $5,370 ) Seat 5: Donce99 ( $2,287 ) Seat 6: 19TS47 ( $1,865 ) Seat 9: hebert8 ( $1,138 ) Seat 10: poker.ded ( $1,382 ) olbert66 posts small blind [$25] llinutee posts big blind [$50] ** Dealing down cards ** Donce99 folds 19TS47 folds hebert8 raises [$220] poker.ded folds shinyone folds czatol07 folds olbert66 calls [$195] llinutee folds ** Dealing flop ** [ 2d, 3d, 4d ] olbert66 bets [$245] hebert8 raises [$490] olbert66 calls [$245] ** Dealing turn ** [ Jh ] olbert66 checks hebert8 bets [$428] olbert66 calls [$428] ** Dealing river ** [ 5s ] ** Summary ** olbert66 shows [ Ac, Qd ] hebert8 shows [ Kd, Kc ] olbert66 collected [ $2,326 ]

[hebert10]

Re: The Road to Ruin... Been playing a bit of heads up lately to improve on my one on one game... #Game No : 468256819 ***** Cassava Hand History for Game 468256819 ***** $25/$50 Blinds No Limit Holdem - *** Tournament #46334877 $1 + $0.10 - Table #1 (Real Money) Seat 9 is the button Total number of players : 2 Seat 4: hebert8 ( $2,150 ) Seat 9: paripok ( $850 ) paripok posts small blind [$25] hebert8 posts big blind [$50] ** Dealing down cards ** Dealt to hebert8 [ 8d, Td ] paripok calls [$25] hebert8 raises [$50] paripok raises [$100] hebert8 calls [$50] ** Dealing flop ** [ 9d, 7h, 3d ] hebert8 bets [$100] paripok raises [$700] hebert8 calls [$600] ** Dealing turn ** [ Kc ] ** Dealing river ** [ 4s ] ** Summary ** hebert8 shows [ 8d, Td ] paripok shows [ ?????? ] paripok collected [ $1,700 ] Can anyone guess what he turned over here?

[ashj22]

Re: The Road to Ruin...

Stuff like this is happening way to much lately! #Game No : 463996418 ***** Cassava Hand History for Game 463996418 ***** $25/$50 Blinds No Limit Holdem - *** Tournament #46281412 $5.45 + $0.55 - Table #9 (Real Money) Seat 2 is the button Total number of players : 8 Seat 1: shinyone ( $2,740 ) Seat 2: czatol07 ( $1,710 ) Seat 3: olbert66 ( $3,418 ) Seat 4: llinutee ( $5,370 ) Seat 5: Donce99 ( $2,287 ) Seat 6: 19TS47 ( $1,865 ) Seat 9: hebert8 ( $1,138 ) Seat 10: poker.ded ( $1,382 ) olbert66 posts small blind [$25] llinutee posts big blind [$50] ** Dealing down cards ** Donce99 folds 19TS47 folds hebert8 raises [$220] poker.ded folds shinyone folds czatol07 folds olbert66 calls [$195] llinutee folds ** Dealing flop ** [ 2d, 3d, 4d ] olbert66 bets [$245] hebert8 raises [$490] olbert66 calls [$245] ** Dealing turn ** [ Jh ] olbert66 checks hebert8 bets [$428] olbert66 calls [$428] ** Dealing river ** [ 5s ] ** Summary ** olbert66 shows [ Ac, Qd ] hebert8 shows [ Kd, Kc ] olbert66 collected [ $2,326 ]

my opinion on this hand with blinds at 25/50 you raised 220 it looks like you potted it, i would raise small because you want calls with a monster like kk. your stack is 22bb flop comes 2 3 4 all diamonds so you have an overpair with a re draw to the k high flush which is a pretty huge hand considering your stack size. when he leads out on the flop u min raise which is basically saying i have a huge hand which you dont want to do. because then people can put you on a hand easier. here on the flop i would just call and have already planned in your head your commited but by calling your not saying i have a monster which is what you want.

[hebert10]

Re: The Road to Ruin...

my opinion on this hand with blinds at 25/50 you raised 220 it looks like you potted it, i would raise small because you want calls with a monster like kk. your stack is 22bb flop comes 2 3 4 all diamonds so you have an overpair with a re draw to the k high flush which is a pretty huge hand considering your stack size. when he leads out on the flop u min raise which is basically saying i have a huge hand which you dont want to do. because then people can put you on a hand easier. here on the flop i would just call and have already planned in your head your commited but by calling your not saying i have a monster which is what you want.

On reflection I could have played this alot better...Played really badly yesterday should have quit after a couple of games

[hebert10]

Re: The Road to Ruin... New comp on the way, should have it by next week. Can finally start playing more tables and using PT again! :rollin

[Diddy147]

Re: The Road to Ruin...

On reflection I could have played this alot better...Played really badly yesterday should have quit after a couple of games

I have been out of the poker scene for a while now but my take on that hand although similar would be - Pre flop raise 2.5x to max 3x so either 125-150 chips. See how flop comes then faced with flop bet I would either 3x their flop Cbet OR just float (call) their cbet (I would only float the cbet to a certain type of player as although you have KK with a redraw to K flush you are up against 22,33,44, AdXd (so already drawing dead almost) even 55 presents a problem on that flop (open ended draw) so I would be very wary of the float/call.) The best play would be to 3x his flop Cbet and see where you are at after. If he calls then re-evaluate on the turn - If he leads out then again you have a decision - If he has called a 3x re-raise on the flop then he may be a calling station...it's early in the tournament and 1 hand is not going win the whole thing so if he is a station then you may be better slowing down on the turn and river ie-check,check. Keep the pots small in early tournament play - Big pots for big hands KK is not a BIG hand (IMHO) its a high pair in a game that involves 5 cards. It's a decent hand but not a "monster". Anyway that's how I used to approach tournament play. I did bink a few in my time. Maybe the "thinking" is different these days I really wouldn't know. As a positive I like the fact you are starting with a 1k bankroll and seem to be sticking with the $5-$6 buyin range. Good bankroll management is the key to success in online poker. Fire in a few 180 man $4.40's on Stars while you play the other tournaments for a couple of reasons - 1 end game play practice and 2 prevent boardom. Good luck.

[south_eastern_ram]

Re: The Road to Ruin... KK on a 234 diamond board with the king of diamonds is an absolute monster. I fist pump get it in on the flop or turn. UL on river, move on to the next one.

[Diddy147]

Re: The Road to Ruin...

KK on a 234 diamond board with the king of diamonds is an absolute monster. I fist pump get it in on the flop or turn. UL on river, move on to the next one.

Fair play you have your methods and I had mine. I used to do ok but now I wouldn't know as much as you do mate. I see he has 22BB so based on that you are correct but if he were to have 30+ then I would still urge caution tbh. Remember also this guy is not putting in any "real" volume. He seems on the face of it to be studying the game which is not a bad thing until you have the numbers down and your shove/fold ranges are in place and you know generally what you are doing THEN you can multi table with ease rather than trying to "play poker"....just my opinion though.

[south_eastern_ram]

Re: The Road to Ruin...

Fair play you have your methods and I had mine. I used to do ok but now I wouldn't know as much as you do mate. I see he has 22BB so based on that you are correct but if he were to have 30+ then I would still urge caution tbh. Remember also this guy is not putting in any "real" volume. He seems on the face of it to be studying the game which is not a bad thing until you have the numbers down and your shove/fold ranges are in place and you know generally what you are doing THEN you can multi table with ease rather than trying to "play poker"....just my opinion though.

I'm no expert mate, still learning the game. But I cant think of any reason why you wouldnt be playing for stacks with this hand on this flop. Readless, I expect most villains to show up with 77-JJ with a diamond or AdX a lot of the time, both of which you're favourite against. Worst case scenario and they've flopped a set/straight you've still got 35%-40% equity. You cant pass up small edges in tournaments

[ashj22]

Re: The Road to Ruin... im totally fine with playing for stacks on the flop given the stack size but the reason i would just call is i want to look as weak as possible therefore getting value out of every hand i can if u just go ahead and jam flop your folding out all random 2x 3x which no doubt what the fishes will have a fair amount.