erhaab1965
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Posts posted by erhaab1965
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Re: rule 4 query at Towcester
Unless.... I had a cashier once who I taught to do mental settling. She wasnt ripping the customer off that I am aware but was ripping the company off a treat!! I'd obviously settle te bets and hand them to her' date=' she would do her thing and pay the bets out and let me know how much she had paid out.... The sly bunt was adding a 1 or 2 in front of my returns and pocketing the 10 or 20 quid!! Being more interested in reading form than checking her payout lists, she got away with it for too long!!! How I kept my job after that I have no idea!!![/quote'] In the nearest betting shop to my home I went to collect 5 winning slips which amounted to several hundreds of pounds , the assistant manager paid me the exact amount less £10. I went to sit down and pulled out my calculator with the Racing Post results page open , a minute later he came over and said there was an error in the system which meant the wrong amounts came on the screen and gave me the missing £10....what a liar !! Its been over 10 years since I've been in that shop , he's now the manager. -
Re: rule 4 query at Towcester
When bets are taken after the " off " the cashiers may not know if the bet has been accepted , but when they have to enter the bets into the system surely they will be made aware that some bets have been taken too late and are not accepted. To not tell the punter if he is still in the shop is when I'd call fraud especially if the horse loses and the punter throws his slip away. Only twice on differerent occasions/shops had I backed a non runner and gone to collect on a different day with the original slip only to find somebody had already collected my returned stake. I can only think that a cashier had collected as nobody else would have known about my non runner bets and they also saw me leave the shop.Depends on the length of the race, there is a 'window' of lateness for sure, well back in 2009 there was anyway. EDIT: Also we did see winning bets on the screen and were told not to tell the winners about them, and I know of a guy who got sacked from fishing out non-runners from the bins and cashing them in. -
Re: rule 4 query at Towcester
I'm not naming any individuals just saying it goes on. Can't say what the system is for all firms but I know some cashiers know when bets are not accepted , so to not say anything when the horse loses and the punter remains in the shop is what I would consider fraud. Also a cashier told me they are no longer allowed to inform regular punters who have winning bets which have not been collected in a long time , even though they recognise the winning punters handwriting. Isn't that unethical too ? Are they called "sleeper bets" in your trade ?Pretty strong allegation, not sure we should be using those terms to be honest as you have no proof whatsoever or know how the system works in all shops. In my local shop it isn't known whether a bet is too late until the bar code is flashed from the bet receipt, which cant be done until the backer brings it to the counter, whether that be straight after the race or an hour later. Punters sit there all day and rush up at the very last second and its the bookies fault half the time? PS: The punter can always ask the cashier to flash the bet as soon as it is put on just to double check if its void or not before the race has finished, a guy i know who often puts dogs bets on the bell always does this. -
Re: rule 4 query at Towcester When punters put bets on after the off in my local Betfred the cashier always says "..let me check if its been accepted .." In another Betfred a mile away they don't do this , although I appreciate the other cashier is being nice and doesn't have to do it. In this Betfred over the years the manageress has tried to short change me on numerous ocassions. One of her favorite tricks is to underpay by £1 exactly on mulitple bets. Having been ripped off by mostly independant bookies from time to time in my younger days I always carried a calculator to calculate my returns prior to collection. I noticed quite often this particular manageress would short change me when doing mulitples and on football coupons. On some occasions when I got multiple bets up I'd send in a friend to collect only to have them come back with £1 less than expected just to test out my theory. I noticed a lot of pensioners would question the manageress about the returns , obviously I don't know what the bets/returns are but I suspect she is making a few quid a day short changing punters. I believe over 95% are honest , but there'll always be those who are out there is make a few extra quid by ripping off punters/employers.
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Re: rule 4 query at Towcester
One thing I have noticed a couple of times when going into a bookies are when a race is about to go off' date=' you get a mad rush to the counter with everyone trying to get their bets on. I have seen a few times people going to collect their winnings only to be told that they didn't get the bet on in time. I don't know how it works but when exactly does the cashier know that the bet isn't on? Is it when they put it through the machine to put it on or is it when they flash the slip after the race? I would be extremely frustrated if this happened to me but touch wood it never will.[/quote'] In a lot of bookies I have experienced or witnessed putting bets on races which were not accepted. If I am going to spend an afternoon in a betting shop I tend to accumulate a few winning slips before collecting. Sometimes I have gone to collect on a winner only to be told I put the bet on too late and would only be getting my stake back. This is fair enough , at the time I probably know its close to the off or they have just set off. But I expect to be told immediately , not an hour or more after the event !! When this happens it is a deliberate act of fraud. They are hoping you have backed a loser and they just pocket the money , if you come to collect you get your stake back. I have seen this time and time again over the years in various shops. -
Re: rule 4 query at Towcester I bet quite regularly in shops and know that a lot of staff are clueless about horse racing and sports in general . Earlier in the year I asked for odds on the Cheltenham Gold Cup in January and was asked is it running today ? This evening I collected a short priced each way equally divided double , one won and the other came second but the cashier settled it place to place !! After a bit of dialogue and the intervention of a co worker I got the correct returns , more than 50% extra !! Almost every time I have a winning EW ED bet , it is incorrectly settled , on occassions they pay me too much. I have no understanding about the training cashiers undertake but in my opinion they are clueless about the industry compared to in 10 years ago . Whilst the computerisation of settling bets has made it more efficient , it has made the quality of service worse. At one shop a manager refused to accept my non full cover tricast perm because he did not know how to enter it into his system. The same manager refused to ring customer services for me one saturday when I asked him to find out which was the trifecta roll over race , he claimed I was confusing the roll over with a scoop6 roll over , and he had never heard of a trifecta roll over in all his years working for the Tote ( now Betfred shop )
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Re: Wanted !! tricast/trifecta staking plan.
had a go again this week and only had the first 2 in my perm but still got a return of £9 for my 10p stakes' date=' don't know what that was for.[/quote'] Unlucky for hitting the crossbar again , even though you were unlucky again I hope you can appreciate the massive value in this bet , also how relatively easy it is to get this bet up. Again 3 fancied horses came 1/2/3 which is not what we want but it was still 2 and a half times better than the tricast dividend. The £9 return may be a refund for any non runners you included. -
Re: Doncaster 7:25 With another duck egg next to its name and another 2lbs lower , it was again favorite , nice draw next to the rails but was in last position and had to go wide and only just failed. Definately handicapped to win but everybody is aware of it now so they may decide not to win with it at the moment , who knows.
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Re: Good horses with bad trainers...
M Johnstons brief is to find group horses for Godolphin , which he has been doing for since Godolphin was concieved. In the past year M J has given them Monterosso , Campanologist and Mastery all international Gr1 winners. Infact when Godolphin first changed to the now familiar all navy blue colours the first horse to carry those colours was an ex MJ horse. Conversely with decent horses which dont quite make the grade for Godolphin they go to MJ. It is the same for the Hamdan al Maktoum owned Godolphin horses and M TregoningGodolphin used to take a lot of 2 year olds off Mark Johnston and then ready them for their classic campaign at 3. I'm not sure if this is still the case. -
Re: What is the best type of bet in horse racing ?
You can bet via most online bookies or via betting shops with Tote Direct terminals. Some online bookies offer % cashback too on occasions. I personally bet in the shops because I can use the slips to do non full cover perms , eg any 8 to win , 9 to come 2nd and 12 to come 3rd. Online only allows you to do full cover perms so for 10 selections at 10p it will cost you £72. , unless you have time to do lots of smaller perms. Todays result see another favorite win ,infact like in the last few weeks the top few in the betting have been comming 1/2/3 which is what we dont want to see. Nevertheless it still paid £964 vs £393 !!!Just seen the other thread in systems/personal threads. Can you only put this bet on via tote or can you put it on via other bookies/betfair etc? I'm interested in having a good look at this as I think you could have a good point that it is purposely underadvertised. -
Re: The Jockey Thread
That was diplomacy comming from Ed Dunlop's mouth. Had it been the Ascot Gold Cup theres no doubt a top jockey would have been onboard.Ed Dunlop said after the race that the horse is being targeted at the Melbourne Cup again and that the trainer prefers to have a local jockey on board that knows the track. That's fair enough I suppose as the Melbourne track is quite tricky from what I remember? I backed Lucas Cranach last year that finished placed but I am sure in the build up they kept mentioning the track. -
Re: Wanted !! tricast/trifecta staking plan. £16+K Newmarket 2.45
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Re: What is the best type of bet in horse racing ? I've just been informed theres over £16k added to 2.45 Newmarket prizepool for the Trifecta , arguably one of the best bests this week. I'm pretty sure less than 1% of the betting public will be aware of this roll over !! Its a very easy bet to get up , lot lot easier than picking the winner. Minimum stakes 10p !!!!!! It is certain to beat the tricast dividend.
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Re: Good horses with bad trainers... Had Young Mick been trained by SB Suroor / H Cecil / Sir M Stoute ...etc theres no way the horse would have been rated in the 50s. Often with Godolphin if they don't reach their potential by the end of their 3YO career they are sent to the glue factory / passed on to secondary Godolphin trainers like M Tragoning/M Johnston / or sold to other trainers. With George Margarson he must have known it was a potential good one as a 2YO ( back in the 90s he won a Gr1 ( although only a 4 horse race and the horse was disqualified too ). He must have planned Young Micks improvement to start as a 4YO. This may be to extract a few years of training fees for the horse . Had he trained more Godolphin quality horses I'm sure he would have had a lot more horses going from 50 to 100+.
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Re: Your biggest betting disaster/**** up!? I posted this before but here it is again. I was betting via my Skybox back in the day when internet connection was very slow. Whenever you type on the keypad there is always slight delay. I bet £333 on a horse then logged off. Next day my balance had rocketed.I double checked and saw I had bet £3333 !!!! Potential disaster , it taught me to take my time and double check before accepting the bets.
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Re: Bookmakers limits - an idea and your thoughts Bet £3.65 are one of the worst online bookies , they are spineless ,they only like mug punters. Ladbrokes in this years Grand National allowed me only £50 on Synchronised first thing in the morning , yet a few minutes before the off Gary Wiltshire says on BBC that Lad-brokes had laid a punter a bet of £50,000 at the same odds , was that BS ?
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Re: Good horses with bad trainers... I don't believe there are bad trainers , maybe trainers with poor facilities and poor horses. I believe all trainers can get horses to win suitable targets if they want to no matter how many horses they train. Even Peter Grayson is probably a decent trainer ,given the right circumstances. I can't really comment about Easy Terms as i don't have a clue about horses/training but I'm sure the reason for his improvement is not because his previous trainer cannot train. Even though I say all trainers know their job I know plenty of trainers take the pi-ss out of punters /owners. For example some trainers ensure the rate of improvement takes place over a few seasons opting to win a race or 2 followed by a few poor runs , then the same the following season. An example is a small trainer called George Margarson in Newmarket. I recall about 12 years ago Pricewise ( Mel Collier ) tipping a horse of his called Atavus for a handicap off a rating in the 80's. The horse couldn't win off that mark and went on to lose a few more races in the process going down in the ratings. The following year he was so well handicaped the horse won the Bunbury Cup ( heritage h'cap) and the Tote International ( very very big prize money race ) , the horse went on to be a regular pattern horse over the next few years. To me the trainer took the pi-ss. How can a horse not win off 80 odd yet win the Tote International / Hungerford stakes a year or 2 later ? He took the pi=ss a few years later with a horse called Young Mick who again at his best was a pattern horse. The horse in his early days was under trained till it went down to a rating in the 50s , then suddenly he mops up plenty of races/prizemoney. In one season he goes from 50 odd to winning a Gr3 !! If these horses were trained by SB Suroor they would have been group performers at 3 , no handbraking whatsoever. I have never liked G Margarson since , you never know whether he intends to win with his horses or not. I'm sure we can all name many many bent trainers between us . ( G Margerson is bent in my opinion only ) As for jockeys thats a different story , there are top jockeys and there are poor jockeys.
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Re: Pricewise Tom Segal does race previews on Ladbrokes TV in the mornings , so they will be aware of what he is tipping long before the other bookies. Over 10 years ago all I could get was usually £25 or less , now if i want to back a horse he has also tipped its still the same amounts. Does anyone on here get bigger amounts on ? Pricewise is pointless if your average stake is higher than £25.
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Re: Pricwewise
Sorry I don't quite understand what you are saying , but what I'm trying to say is that if you fancy a horse and the price stands out then tip it , but why would you tip a horse you don't fancy but the price sticks out. Whatever he tips is not value anyway because it will always be at deflated odds. Saint , don't know if I am allowed to advertise any other website but if you google "Tom Segal Tips " you will come across a site which has all his past tips with analysis. Please delete if I have broken forum rules.surely his column is based on a combination of price and form in an abstract way not purely determinable from figures etc -
Re: The Jockey Thread Fantastic to see TG McLaughlan win the Yorkshire Cup ( Group 2 ) , he has been considered a journeyman jockey for all his riding career and today he's finally won a big race. Well done . Probably the horse will be campaigned at the top races around the world and unfortunately for Tom will probably have a top jockey aboard in future . At least he's won a Group race which very few jockeys ever achieve.
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Re: The Jockey Thread Great to see Daragh O'Donohoe back riding in Britain again , not seen him here for a few years. He's a decent jockey who has won multiple Gr1's and had often rode for multiple Gr1 winning trainer S B Suroor , lets hope he has a fruitful season.
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Re: Pricwewise
Because yesterday he probably considered that the price on Fencing was 'out'. No doubt' date=' if Bonfire had been 13/2 and Fencing 3/1 he would have gone for Bonfire.[/quote'] Going by what you are saying then his selection is based on price and not form. Nowhere in his column did he even hint that Bonfire was his ante post selection posted only last week. -
I've not been a backer of Pricewise for 10 years now mainly due to not being able to get on or being restricted to tiny amounts but i still read every column. In yesterdays edition he advised Fencing in the Dante ( Derby trail ) . Only last week he advised Bonfire for the Derby but today he offered no explanation to why he has opposed his ante post selection in favour of Fencing further down in the betting. If you backed Bonfire last week then surely you'd want it to win and not a less fancied horse. Result............... Bonfire wins. I don't know why he didn't even acknowledge Bonfire as his ante post selection. Strange tipping !
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Re: Racing bans
Correct both were banned for welfare issues . During the summer of Hendersons ban , his horse Carichola was sent to B Hills who raced at Royal Ascot , if he was banned why was he allowed to be present ? a pathetic ban in my opinion , He was even allowed to train during that period , he just wasn't allowed to enter his horses for races. If you or got a driving ban , we cannot drive. Or if we got caught shoplifting we may go to prison as punishment. Trainers they simply switch names on the license and carry on as normal.If Sir M Stoute got a ban wouldn't he simply get his boyfriend to "train" them ?It's not only cons. Didn't Henderson get banned after one of his runners was found to have a banned substance in its system? Howard Johnson got banned for something similar too I think?
rule 4 query at Towcester
in At The Races - Racing Forum
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Re: rule 4 query at Towcester