Danshot Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 Well after taking a few weeks off to refresh my mind as was getting tortured by some the hands was involved in especially when chasing a lose , when was no need as build up bankroll from initial deposit , I normally deposit £20 onto stars and 2 separate occasions manage to run it upto $150 , $190 and $120 before losing it all back continually losing flips and 60/40. Now yesterday I decided to deposit £20/$31 ish and played a $2.20 8 Game Mix were came 2nd outta 38 for $22 a nice lil start back and won a few of heads up games and called it a night up to $80 . today I played a few tourneys got a Final table in FL badugi before I bubbled it after a few dodgy hands. Then here is where it again when wrong I was still on $76 as spent $10 on the MTTs but won a $7 HU during one the 5 minute break. After bubbling the final MTT I decided to gamble on a $15 Hyper PLO HU with the intention of going back to micros win or lose. I evidently lost in and chased and lost 3 in a row leaving me back at starting point $30 after losing with the flopped nuts to a runner runner boat , and with QQxx vs JJxx he spikes a Jack with both our stacks committed , I then lose a further 2 and play a No limit HU with the final $15 losing AJcc into 22 AIPF :( , I make a deposit of $30 to try gamble to get my initial deposit back in this game I lose AKcc vs QJcc AIPF. I decide to inject another $60 playing $15 HU and 1 Turbo 6 max where I continue to lose due largely to bad beats :( A9 vs A4 , AQ vs A7 , 88 vs 108 then in the final $15 game I have AJ vs J9 AIPF for 90% the chips and flop comes 75A so think I'm in good shape. Of course the runner runner comes in the form of the 6 then 8. I know this looks like a bad beat post but honestly I am looking at ways to prevent the tilt factor that never used to get. It forces me to doubt my ability to play and that frustrates me more. Any ideas how to stick to sensible limits ? or am I a bit to addicted. I Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teaulc Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 Re: What to do ? Urgent help required you need to learn patience, and also not to chase your losses. i know its hard and very frustrating,but you need to step back.stick to what you are good at. bankroll management is a must in your situation,dont play anything more than 10% of your bankroll to start with.patience,patience and more patience. did i mention patience?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danshot Posted June 29, 2012 Author Share Posted June 29, 2012 Re: What to do ? Urgent help required I never used to chase my losses , do you reckon its better to make one large deposit so I know I have to play with in roll my roll as I cant reload for the same sum again for over a couple of months ? I'm trying patience and thought got it back after the 3 weeks off but then jumped into the wrong games :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nade Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 Re: What to do ? Urgent help required Well after taking a few weeks off to refresh my mind as was getting tortured by some the hands was involved in especially when chasing a lose , when was no need as build up bankroll from initial deposit , I normally deposit £20 onto stars and 2 separate occasions manage to run it upto $150 , $190 and $120 before losing it all back continually losing flips and 60/40. Now yesterday I decided to deposit £20/$31 ish and played a $2.20 8 Game Mix were came 2nd outta 38 for $22 a nice lil start back and won a few of heads up games and called it a night up to $80 . today I played a few tourneys got a Final table in FL badugi before I bubbled it after a few dodgy hands. Then here is where it again when wrong I was still on $76 as spent $10 on the MTTs but won a $7 HU during one the 5 minute break. After bubbling the final MTT I decided to gamble on a $15 Hyper PLO HU with the intention of going back to micros win or lose. I evidently lost in and chased and lost 3 in a row leaving me back at starting point $30 after losing with the flopped nuts to a runner runner boat , and with QQxx vs JJxx he spikes a Jack with both our stacks committed , I then lose a further 2 and play a No limit HU with the final $15 losing AJcc into 22 AIPF :( , I make a deposit of $30 to try gamble to get my initial deposit back in this game I lose AKcc vs QJcc AIPF. I decide to inject another $60 playing $15 HU and 1 Turbo 6 max where I continue to lose due largely to bad beats :( A9 vs A4 , AQ vs A7 , 88 vs 108 then in the final $15 game I have AJ vs J9 AIPF for 90% the chips and flop comes 75A so think I'm in good shape. Of course the runner runner comes in the form of the 6 then 8. I know this looks like a bad beat post but honestly I am looking at ways to prevent the tilt factor that never used to get. It forces me to doubt my ability to play and that frustrates me more. Any ideas how to stick to sensible limits ? or am I a bit to addicted. I look at the range of games you're playing, it's all over the shop, you should concentrate on one thing at a time and try to get good at it, or if you get too bored then either be prepared to lose or quit playing before it costs you a lot more imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnley Joe Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 Re: What to do ? Urgent help required I agree with the comments above My own take on it is that you need to stop and look at all the hands you played during these sessions. Look at what you were succesful at and what did not work. We all go through bad patches mate, and the thing is that it will end and dont get too worried about it. You are only talking about $100 here, so no i dont think you are addicted just yet, i just think you have chased your loses and everyone at some stage has done this. When you lose a couple of games, you need to just take a short break and have a brew or a smoke or whatever, then come back and look at the hands you lost with and then be honest, see if you were actually playing well, or you were chasing and playing like a losing player, but still expecting to win. Only thing i can suggest is if your playing a torney, just play that torney and concentrate on that alone. You say above that you took a "few weeks off to refresh my mind as was getting tortured by some the hands was involved in especially when chasing a lose" To me it sounds like the break has done nothing and you seem to still be chasing. Also, you say that in the 5 minute break you played a quick game, again, this looks like you are chasing money and playing to many games to actually concentrate. I think the only think i can suggest is, set yourself a goal, say three torneys a night, so that you can concentrate. No more, no less, even if you take all three. Also dont go higher, it will just increase loses, also stick to the $2 games. Before starting the next games, review how you did, and then play again with notes from previous days games, what you did well and what you did not do so well. Also, look back at previous results where you actually won a torney and look at the hands you won with, you will probably find you are doing nothing differently, however, beacuse you are chasing loses, your are not thinking logically and are taking it to heart. Sorry to sound negative, but just relax and review mate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danshot Posted June 29, 2012 Author Share Posted June 29, 2012 Re: What to do ? Urgent help required Thanks for the constructive comments guys its most needed in my bid to turn the corner. We all go through bad patches mate, and the thing is that it will end and dont get too worried about it. I honestly think a lot of this is down to poor game selection ie. mixing it up well playing out of my bankroll limits. Since starting work i've struggled to find a level happy to win at but can afford. And have therefore struggled to put together a winning month as dont have time for the volume used to have. Would you both suggest Poker Tracker being a vital purchase? or are they alternatives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danshot Posted June 29, 2012 Author Share Posted June 29, 2012 Re: What to do ? Urgent help required look at the range of games you're playing, it's all over the shop, you should concentrate on one thing at a time and try to get good at it, or if you get too bored then either be prepared to lose or quit playing before it costs you a lot more imo. I have a negative ROI in hold em MTT's think this is due to larger fields and not had the volume put in to see out the true variance. In the smaller field mixed games I tend to fair much better , as think it is perfect as I honestly think I have solid fundamentals in most games and is easier to over come variance. What would you guys think if I say started with a $100 bank roll and just played $3.50 6 Max SnG with a few non-NL MTTs upto $4.40 max of 2 tables? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnley Joe Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 Re: What to do ? Urgent help required Play whatever games you feel comfortable with mate and what you bankroll can afford, so if its 100, then you have 50 $2 games, so at the end of the 50 games you should be making about $120 total, which would give you an ROI of 120% Good luck mate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnley Joe Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 Re: What to do ? Urgent help required [h=2]What is bankroll management?[/h] "Bankroll management" (sometimes abbreviated to BRM) is where you play at certain limits to avoid losing all of your bankroll due to bad runs of cards, which any poker player must expect from time to time. This is called "playing within your bankroll". Subsequently, if you play at higher limits where there is too great a chance of losing all of your poker money, you are "playing out of your bankroll". [h=3]Why is bankroll management important?[/h] The reason why you should choose your limits carefully in poker is due to the variance. Variance is a term used to describe the "ups and downs" of poker where you fluctuate from having bad runs of cards to good runs of cards, resulting in varying profits and losses. If you play poker for long enough there are going to be periods of time where you will consistently lose money, not because you are playing badly, but because the cards are not falling your way. This means that if you do not have enough money in your bankroll to absorb these big downswings, it is likely that you will lose it all. Every player, irrespective of ability, will experience variance in their game. Bankroll management is in place to deal with this variance and allow you to continue playing without going broke. Therefore every time we sit down at the poker table, whether it be live or online, we want to give ourselves the best opportunity to win a maximum amount of profit whilst keeping the risk of going broke minimal. This is where the rules of bankroll management come into play. [h=2]So what limits should I be playing at?[/h][h=3]Cash games.[/h][h=4]Pot limit and no limit Hold'em.[/h] If you are playing pot limit or no limit poker, the safe recommended size of your bankroll is 20 times the full buy-in of where you want to play. This means that if you want to have the best chance of making money at a $1/$2 game where the maximum buy-in is $200, you should have a bankroll of at least $4000. Another way of applying bankroll management is by only putting a maximum 5% of your entire bankroll on the table at any one time, which works out the same as having 20 times the buy-in for the game. [h=4]Limit Hold'em.[/h] If you like to play limit Holdem however, you should have 300 Big Bets as a minimum for the limit you wish to play at. Therefore to play $1/$2 limit Holdem, you should have a bankroll of at least $600. [h=3]Tournament games.[/h] It is recommended that you have a bankroll that will give you 40 buy-ins to the level of tournaments that you wish to play at. Therefore if you want to play at the $10+$1 Sit n Go's you should have a bankroll of $440. [h=2]Bankroll management table.[/h][TABLE=class: plain, align: center] [TR] [TD][TABLE=class: bankroll] NL Holdem [TR] [TH]Blinds[/TH] [TH]Bankroll[/TH] [/TR] [TR] [TD]5c/10c[/TD] [TD]$200[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]10c/20c[/TD] [TD]$400[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]25c/50c[/TD] [TD]$1,000[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]$0.50/$1[/TD] [TD]$2,000[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]$1/$2[/TD] [TD]$4,000[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]$2/$4[/TD] [TD]$8,000[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]$5/$10[/TD] [TD]$16,000[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]$10/$20[/TD] [TD]$40,000[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]$25/$50[/TD] [TD]$100,000[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]$50/$100[/TD] [TD]$200,000[/TD] [/TR] [/TABLE] [/TD] [TD][TABLE=class: bankroll] Limit Holdem [TR] [TH]Blinds[/TH] [TH]Bankroll[/TH] [/TR] [TR] [TD]5c/10c[/TD] [TD]$30[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]10c/20c[/TD] [TD]$60[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]25c/50c[/TD] [TD]$150[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]$0.50/$1[/TD] [TD]$300[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]$1/$2[/TD] [TD]$600[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]$2/$4[/TD] [TD]$1,200[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]$5/$10[/TD] [TD]$3,000[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]$10/$20[/TD] [TD]$6,000[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]$25/$50[/TD] [TD]$15,000[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]$50/$100[/TD] [TD]$30,000[/TD] [/TR] [/TABLE] [/TD] [TD][TABLE=class: bankroll] SnG Tournaments [TR] [TH]Blinds[/TH] [TH]Bankroll[/TH] [/TR] [TR] [TD]$1 + $0.1[/TD] [TD]$44[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]$2 + $0.2[/TD] [TD]$88[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]$5 + $0.5[/TD] [TD]$220[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]$10 +$1[/TD] [TD]$440[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]$20 +$2[/TD] [TD]$880[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]$30 +$3[/TD] [TD]$1,320[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]$50 +$5[/TD] [TD]$2,200[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]$100 +$10[/TD] [TD]$4,400[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]$200 +$20[/TD] [TD]$8,800[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]$500 +$50[/TD] [TD]$22,000[/TD] [/TR] [/TABLE] [/TD] [/TR] [/TABLE] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danshot Posted June 30, 2012 Author Share Posted June 30, 2012 Re: What to do ? Urgent help required Play whatever games you feel comfortable with mate and what you bankroll can afford, so if its 100, then you have 50 $2 games, so at the end of the 50 games you should be making about $120 total, which would give you an ROI of 120% Good luck mate Do you mean $20 PROFIT that is my plan to stick around $2 but stars are $3.50 and $1.50 so might just top the bankroll up as I should be a winner at $3.50 with patience Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnley Joe Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Re: What to do ? Urgent help required Thats fine mate, but i would recommend that with the $3.50, you have about 28 buy ins, so if after 14 the results are still not coming, drop down a levle it will give you more games for your money Sorry yeah $20 profit, per $100 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heniek31 Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Re: What to do ? Urgent help required Well, Nade and Joe said it all, but if I was first to respond, I would have been more harsh than that. I had to read 1st post 3 times and was still confused. Pure madness, pure lunacy and pure chaos. It looks like you came back hungry for poker, the more the better, no goals etc. My best advice is to lay off any form of HU (at least for now). There are always sharks waiting. One of my friends, constantly wins hundreds in MTTs and then goes and blows all off in HU. Make yourself a goal and stick to it. Plan your sessions. When you sit down for the evening, have some idea what do you want to play. Stick to it. Give you an example. My sessions are very like from day to day. I will start at 6pm. Will register into 6-10 MTTs. I WILL NOT (or hardly ever) register to any MTTs after 8.30pm. It doesn't matter how session goes, no registering for more after that time. Some days I will not cash for even $1 and and will be out of all by 9.30 and I'm done. Next day I will be still sitting there at 2am. Do you get my point? Don't play for sake of it or because you are not satisfied with the ones you played. It won't do you any good trying to catch up. Next day will be another chance to play more. Don't mix games. Stick to sessions either of MTTs, SnGs, or cash. Play NL one evening, variants on other evening. I was still on $76 as spent $10 on the MTTs but won a $7 HU during one the 5 minute break. WTF????????? I nearly fell of the chair when I saw this. It just shows how desperate you are for games. Waaaaaaaaaay to bad. It's called a break for a reason. Stand up, stretch your legs, have a drink, have a wank. Whatever it is, have a break. Let say you were on the final table and comes a 5 minutes break. You go and play HU. You lose 2 AIPF with Aces. Break is over. You are coming back to your final table totaly fuked off and fuming from those two hands. Now, there is no way you are going to play the same game on the FT like you did before the break. Again, I hope you get my point. Sorry for harsh words. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danshot Posted June 30, 2012 Author Share Posted June 30, 2012 Re: What to do ? Urgent help required Thanks for more input , its slowly sinking in how crazy I've been playing and no matter how good I think I can play the fact is I'm ruining any ability to win by acting like a de-gen who just seems set to gamble it up until hit a brick wall. I used to play heads up profitably until started playing hyper turbos like a adrenaline junkie I could 4 table the 4 man shoot outs and end most sessions up but all my focus with on Head Up SnGs. For now i'm going to try steer clear of Heads Up , I have at least 5 days of long shifts at work now and won't get a chance to play any evenings , but when I next get a day off I will set a thread detailing my goals and objectives so that you guys can see if the changes I will attempt are for the better. Thanks for the feedback the harsh words were needed to be honest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnley Joe Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Re: What to do ? Urgent help required Dan i have Pmd you, what i want you to do is get back to me next Friday and let me know Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teaulc Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Re: What to do ? Urgent help required cracking advise from Joe and Heniek,Dan, here is a link to a thread i posted up a while ago. plenty of other threads that may help you in the strategy forum as well,just cos i posted them up doesnt mean they are worthless :p http://forum.punterslounge.com/threads/111398-5-Rules-to-Save-Your-Online-Bankroll it seems also that a lack of confidence is missing from your game as well,the advise that the guys have given you will help get that back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glceud Posted July 1, 2012 Share Posted July 1, 2012 Re: What to do ? Urgent help required Naw you just need to tweek your approach slightly, first sign of any downturn fire up 4 tables of omaha hi/lo(easiest way to win money fast/or lose it) if this fails hit the zoom/rush/blaze tables(even quicker way to win/lose). If you still havent got your cash back hit the online slots(more lines the better) As it's now probably 3 in the morning and as a final precaution make sure you always have some money in your betfair account for the 5th race on a 12 race card from Delaware. ( or even a chinese under 18 beach volleyball match in the final quarter will do) Been using this strategy for years and it works just fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ashj22 Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 Re: What to do ? Urgent help required it dosent matter how much money your bankroll is if you dont have bankroll management YOU WILL BUST! also to help tilt dont play when your bored or if your drunk, when you do play just play your own game and what your comfortable with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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