Betting for a living

[western skies]

Re: Betting for a living

Only because there are a thousand other posts / thread put up all the time going over the same ground all the time. It's all good valid stuff, but it does become a bit like a broken record.... Mayfly's posts were slightly different, and a little more of a unique read....

Probably not a popular view, but I have to disagree here. Once you got past the metaphors and science bit, Mayfly was basically preaching the standard stuff - discipline and understanding the market. It may sound like a broken record the way everyone else says it, but we all say it because it's true. I know it's tempting to think that a pro gambler will come along and tell everyone how to get rich, but it isn't going to happen. The truth is that they apply the same basic principles as the rest of us, they're just better at sticking to them. And, if they've found an edge, they certainly aren't going to share it. Having said that, I see no reason for Mayfly to stay away. What he was posting made sense and the keyboard warrior who was being a pain in the arse is no longer with us, so he's got no reason to just disappear.

What is it that makes it work for a professional? Trading or Specific researched bets Patience Discipline Recording information Inside information Which sports work well, ie I follow football but many here make & lose money on all sports etc...? l

All of the above can make you money. It's about finding something that works for you. Some people can make money on just about any sport (we've got a few of them here, look at kevshat for example) whilst it suits others to specialise. The point is, whilst it's always useful to hear how other people (pro gamblers or not) approach betting, just because that approach works for them doesn't automatically mean it will work for you. The only way to find out is to put in the long hours. :ok

[Alexc]

Re: Betting for a living

Probably not a popular view, but I have to disagree here. Once you got past the metaphors and science bit, Mayfly was basically preaching the standard stuff - discipline and understanding the market. It may sound like a broken record the way everyone else says it, but we all say it because it's true. I know it's tempting to think that a pro gambler will come along and tell everyone how to get rich, but it isn't going to happen. The truth is that they apply the same basic principles as the rest of us, they're just better at sticking to them. And, if they've found an edge, they certainly aren't going to share it. Having said that, I see no reason for Mayfly to stay away. What he was posting made sense and the keyboard warrior who was being a pain in the arse is no longer with us, so he's got no reason to just disappear.

Yup.

[mayfly]

Re: Betting for a living Most of what I have posted has to do with the subconcious and I find it mildly ironic that some of the replies to this thread completely ignores my original reason for posting. Sports betting forums are full of genuine people looking for guidance and advice so its understandable that it attracts others with delusions of superiority. Posters like nightmare do not concern me, although the clutter is annoying. Betting Forums are generally mundane places and these posters can give a reminder to everyone to chill out and have fun, a little dig isnt the end of the World. More annoying is the replies stating that my view is wrong, not for what these posters have experienced but for what they have read and not questioned. Never take anyones advice as word, always satisify your own mind of its credibility. However, the real cancer on betting forums are the posters who constantly inform people of their brilliant knowledge without actually contributing anything. The fact that the particular posters in this thread that claim experience are devoid of superior betting knowledge only proves the point. One only needs to look at the threads they have started to realise the depth of their betting sharpness. Once again, My reason for posting on here is to hopefully bring bettors up to a standard of confidence where their hobby will be costing them at minimum a trifle compared to the potential loss of home and family that sadly some encounter. Maybe I need to change the format or something but hopefully we will get there in the end. :ok

[angeal]

Re: Betting for a living Good to have you back Mayfly - hope your wife is doing aswell as possible, that is so much more important than using any emotional energy on this board, whatever gets written. As you will have read, I for one am enjoy your thoughts. I am not expecting any given formula, just interested in seeing others view points. I would really like to make a full time living from this but still very much in a learning process. Al

[stefan2008]

Re: Betting for a living

Probably not a popular view, but I have to disagree here. Once you got past the metaphors and science bit, Mayfly was basically preaching the standard stuff - discipline and understanding the market. It may sound like a broken record the way everyone else says it, but we all say it because it's true.

I think you missed the point here. His was not trying to reinvent the wheel but to present the things we're all familiar with in unconventional way, and he's done it brilliantly. Why complicate the simple stuff, the question arises. The answer is rather complex and has to do with the way our mind works. Most of us will hardly bother to read through all of those patienceanddisciplinearekey type of posts even though they're all valid advices. But we find it boring (assuming we are willing to learn and refresh our knowledge of matter) because it doesn't have any conceptualization behind, just plain words that have been repeated thousands and thousands of times over. It's not appealing to our mind which will take a lot time to embrace it, if at all. That is one of the better sides of our psychological structure, however, imagine believing everything you hear or read without questioning it. On the other hand, when you have a concept supporting the resulting idea it has a way bigger potential to become belief, and because all our decisions are based on beliefs, it's absolutely crucial to have ones that correspond to reality. In the process of forming beliefs, keyword for mind is evidence, you need to find an evidence to support your thought in order for it to become belief. I find

Another genetic blast from the past is your brains ability to convince you your actions are correct, hence the stubbornness found in everyday life. While one can see how this Fail/safe stops inner conflict which may lead to mental instability, it wrecks havoc in a situation on an exchange. There’s no problem when you are right, you trade out at your predetermined figure, congratulate yourself on your shrewdness, get your shot of dopamine and all is good in the World. However, when the trade goes the other way, in comes the millions of years genetic make up. Selling out for a loss before the event has started not only means a loss but worse, proof that you were wrong and because the price is on the drift its almost certain more losses will follow yet you doggedly hold on to the belief you are right. Just when things seem they can’t get worse, rather than take your punishment you chance leaving the liability all on that one selection, yes the one you paradoxically expected to win. And of course the rest is history, but never mind, your brain will do its age old business and you are ready to give it another go in the knowledge that loss was an unfortunate blip never to be repeated. Don’t worry, we’ve all been there but it’s good to know why.

far more convincing than "controlling your emotion is key to be successful".

[twinny]

Re: Betting for a living

Most of what I have posted has to do with the subconcious and I find it mildly ironic that some of the replies to this thread completely ignores my original reason for posting. Sports betting forums are full of genuine people looking for guidance and advice so its understandable that it attracts others with delusions of superiority. Posters like nightmare do not concern me, although the clutter is annoying. Betting Forums are generally mundane places and these posters can give a reminder to everyone to chill out and have fun, a little dig isnt the end of the World. More annoying is the replies stating that my view is wrong, not for what these posters have experienced but for what they have read and not questioned. Never take anyones advice as word, always satisify your own mind of its credibility. However, the real cancer on betting forums are the posters who constantly inform people of their brilliant knowledge without actually contributing anything. The fact that the particular posters in this thread that claim experience are devoid of superior betting knowledge only proves the point. One only needs to look at the threads they have started to realise the depth of their betting sharpness. Once again, My reason for posting on here is to hopefully bring bettors up to a standard of confidence where their hobby will be costing them at minimum a trifle compared to the potential loss of home and family that sadly some encounter. Maybe I need to change the format or something but hopefully we will get there in the end. :ok

good point mayfly i think,but you cant start a thread betting for a living,write a load about your inner brain which is probably spot on,then leave it a week wait for replys and knock the replyers without even giving a stratergy,a bet(only a bet if market favours) a top read maybe mayfly,but i doubt you will make a living without a bet,only a week offline i know and you might say "well im being patient" but you havnt told anyone on the thread that,are we to wait 1 week,1 month or 1 year to make a living? just my thoughts, i understand you want to teach discipline,about how to accept a loss without chaseing,get a stratergy that works and stick to it but so far there has been no stratergy a bit of inner brain stuff,no plan ,no bank,no specific sport,no idea,if i was betting for a living following this i would just about be getting hungry now...sorry its negative but .......??? lets get it going "betting for a living" :-)

[froment]

Re: Betting for a living :loon :welcome back, Mayfly, nice to see you again! Looking forward to your new posts! :ok

i doubt you will make a living without a bet' date='only a week offline i know and you might say "well im being patient" but you havnt told anyone on the thread that,are we to wait 1 week,1 month or 1 year to make a living?[/quote'] You're making the same mistake as another poster in this thread before you; that is, commenting without properly reading previous posts; look at the very first post of this thread, where it clearly says:

[twinny]

Re: Betting for a living yep correct, but there are also(im not saying bets) but potential trades made in the second week in july that were given a good write up as potentially warrenting some kind of investment be it backing to trade out in running with no follow up to what trades were actually done on these horses(if any) if giving horses out to trade or potentially trade(i actually think they were put there to give us an insight into how mayfly trades/bets/gambles) then there should be a follow up of what trades were succesfull(if any were done),which were not and how do you get out if the market goes the wrong way? I'm giving these situations out to show that with a little work certain horses can be pin-pointed for some sort of investment. Experience will show you how to treat these potential earners, some will be easy to trade into a position of winnings to zero loss, others to gain a mathematical advantage far beyond SP, others have the value of just betting and leaving in a lay in running on Betfair at a nominal price to recover stakes. the above is off the thread on page one and it does state potential earners(which every horse is in every race)but also potential losers to,did they all green out? if not what kind of loss would we be looking at? do you just green your stake out and take the profit if the horse goes on to win?is this just a form of dobbing or a bit of both? just questions.as i wasnt around on the 9th of july to see any results of the above potential trades again good luck with this mayfly and ive probably jumped the gun with my last post,looking forward to August 1st

[Vilamoura04]

Re: Betting for a living This thread has already filled in 1 or 2 important information gaps for me answering some small but vital questions I had that no one could or would answer. Keep it going macfly i for one appreciate what you are doing and am very keen to hear more. Not really bothered about your bets or stratefgies, not expecting you to have the holy grail of betting strategies and even less share it for nothing. Very interested in your theoretical take on the markets, books and prices which is a subject very poorly covered in published literature or online.

[mayfly]

Re: Betting for a living I must apologise to everyone for maybe misleading you. In my excitement of the prospect of having more time to pursue my hobby I gave little thought to how this thread would pan out. In hindsight the title really isn’t an indication of the content I wanted to post in a hope to improve peoples gambling. From here in rather than try to stick to some sort of agenda I’ll just post when I feel it’s appropriate and hopefully everyone will be happier. Very few people earn a living through betting and all the ones I have known always had an angle or advantage the rest of us didn’t. The task of constantly producing say £500 a week is not only monumental on its own but almost impossible when you take in other factors such as illness etc. My figures over the last five years have produced a profit of £5k -£7k a year from my part time hobby although some would say it’s hardly part time when it takes up all my non working hours. Many acquaintances question this figure as they fail to see why I can’t simply increase my stake accordingly and enjoy the good life, if only it was that easy. As you are now aware, I believe Psychology and an understanding of how our minds work is a major factor in what our gambling produces. Its essential to be aware at all times how your sub-conscious is reacting to situations as its not necessarily working in your favour most of the time. Two critical mindsets in order for the human race to evolve was the ability to quantify RISK/REWARD and the other an EXPECTATION of those rewards, both of these play a significant part in our gambling. Because these cerebral traits have not evolved along with the rest of the human mind we actually have the very same set of triggers that pre-historic man had, however there’s a huge difference between taking a chance on a sabre toothed tiger and assessing the chances of a sporting event. As I stated earlier depending on the RISK/REWARD ratio, your Brain releases varying levels of dopamine and adrenaline that gives you that feel good factor, the bigger the risk the bigger the hit. In nearly all cases the EXPECTATION of reward is perceived larger than actual reality, that’s why we notice other peoples delusions but not our own and people become unrealistic with their chances of success. While this ploy successfully enabled man to leave caves for distant horizons its effect on gambling isn’t quite as straight forward. Generally one improves their betting profits by taking less chances, the safer the percentage the more likely a profit, the downside is your Brain gets less reward and gives you a sense of malaise and boredom. Eventually your betting becomes a tedious task not unlike work itself. To stop this you sub-consciously crave for riskier propositions and when you take them you are instantly invigorated. I have got myself to that happy medium where I get enough buzz from certain bets while maintaining a reasonable profit, a move either way would upset the balance. I remember some years ago on an American betting forum a poster coming up with the absurd idea of keeping aside part of your bank and betting any impulse bets you have against it. (The type you may have on a live TV game without any study, which is also the type of bet your empirical knowledge may lead you to) The theory was that over time these bets would be losers and therefore instead of being detrimental to your fund, it would actually increase your profits. Logically it made sense so I decided to give it a go, within 3 Months I had about £470 profit in my side fund which otherwise would have gone to the bookmakers. But there was one thing wrong in all of this, I wasn’t enjoying it, I was getting no gratification that coming off the rails now and again gives you, in reality I had taken the more chancier bets and put them in a safer environment. The crux of this is everyone needs their expectations of profit to fall in line with not only a reasonable risk/reward strategy but one of realism in your own personality, only then can you be truly happy in this pastime we have chosen. With the new situation I find myself in it’s certainly my intension to profit from any extra input but I’m fully aware of my circumstances and state of mind and that should be the goal of all of us. I will keep this thread to post on the more psychological side of betting and start others specifically for a sport, the ODDSMAKER REQUIRED thread, which I’ll post in shortly will hopefully contain some benefit on Soccer betting. Thanks for all your good wishes. :ok

[davidc]

Re: Betting for a living

Two critical mindsets in order for the human race to evolve was the ability to quantify RISK/REWARD and the other an EXPECTATION of those rewards, both of these play a significant part in our gambling. Because these cerebral traits have not evolved along with the rest of the human mind we actually have the very same set of triggers that pre-historic man had, however there’s a huge difference between taking a chance on a sabre toothed tiger and assessing the chances of a sporting event. As I stated earlier depending on the RISK/REWARD ratio, your Brain releases varying levels of dopamine and adrenaline that gives you that feel good factor, the bigger the risk the bigger the hit. In nearly all cases the EXPECTATION of reward is perceived larger than actual reality, that’s why we notice other peoples delusions but not our own and people become unrealistic with their chances of success. While this ploy successfully enabled man to leave caves for distant horizons its effect on gambling isn’t quite as straight forward.

Hi Mayfly. Not sure that I buy into the above statements - have you any evidence to support them or are they your own perceptions of how the brain works?

[mayfly]

Re: Betting for a living

Hi Mayfly. Not sure that I buy into the above statements - have you any evidence to support them or are they your own perceptions of how the brain works?

I'm certainly not intelligent enough to have discovered these traits and just reading a laymans book on how the brain affects emotions would suffice for anyone. There are two ways of using my posts, use them as a motivator to learn more yourself or as you say, dont buy into it and remain cocooned in old fashioned thinking. The choice is yours. :ok

[gelkinwhite]

Re: Betting for a living love your insight mayfly,i myself try to make money gambling,did the study and internet work morning noon and night had profit and loss like most,then relized luck played a large part of the game,things have to fall perfect for a bet to come in so 1 factor can spoil a days book work and profit.....changed my approach and started forecast backing 1st and 2nd reverse small stakes low strike rate but with the luck factor taken into account and a good staking system have had really good days..skill picking winners is rewarding,skill covering lady lucks mischief also pays,cheers mayfly!!:ok

[mayfly]

Re: Betting for a living

love your insight mayfly' date='i myself try to make money gambling,did the study and internet work morning noon and night had profit and loss like most,then relized luck played a large part of the game,things have to fall perfect for a bet to come in so 1 factor can spoil a days book work and profit.....changed my approach and started forecast backing 1st and 2nd reverse small stakes low strike rate but with the luck factor taken into account and a good staking system have had really good days..skill picking winners is rewarding,skill covering lady lucks mischief also pays,cheers mayfly!!:ok[/quote'] Thanks for your post its reminded me of one of the biggest myths we face, LUCK. Its not luck that is the challenge but our ignorance in understanding how randomness works. Get these subjects on your side, understanding randomness and emotions go a long way to understanding your betting. :ok

[davidc]

Re: Betting for a living

I'm certainly not intelligent enough to have discovered these traits and just reading a laymans book on how the brain affects emotions would suffice for anyone. There are two ways of using my posts' date= use them as a motivator to learn more yourself or as you say, dont buy into it and remain cocooned in old fashioned thinking. The choice is yours. :ok

I didn't say that you had discovered the traits, if they exist in the way you describe them. What I did was to ask the question as to how you were qualified to reference them. Your posts contain some useful information (most of which is just common sense) but the analogies and various padding just gets in the way so why not save some time and just explain your theories and your take on betting in a more factual way. I realise that my point of view appears to be at odds with most others :eek but I don't mean to offend.

[mayfly]

Re: Betting for a living

I didn't say that you had discovered the traits, if they exist in the way you describe them. What I did was to ask the question as to how you were qualified to reference them. Your posts contain some useful information (most of which is just common sense) but the analogies and various padding just gets in the way so why not save some time and just explain your theories and your take on betting in a more factual way. I realise that my point of view appears to be at odds with most others :eek but I don't mean to offend.

You see David this is where I have a problem. You say most of my posts are just common sense yet question the validity of them rather than getting off your backside and researching them yourself. My posts are part of my theories, which go a long way in explaining why a significant percentage of punters lose, many like yourself by your own words are ignorant to this and hopefully it will make a difference. :ok

[Vilamoura04]

Re: Betting for a living

I didn't say that you had discovered the traits, if they exist in the way you describe them. What I did was to ask the question as to how you were qualified to reference them. Your posts contain some useful information (most of which is just common sense) but the analogies and various padding just gets in the way so why not save some time and just explain your theories and your take on betting in a more factual way. I realise that my point of view appears to be at odds with most others :eek but I don't mean to offend.

Why cant he explain his theories whatever way he wants to?

[mayfly]

I found this on the net. At least it shows its not findings. ;) By Jonah Lehrer | August 19, 2007 When Ann Klinestiver, a high school English teacher in Milton, W.Va., was first diagnosed with Parkinson's disease, she was desperate for anything that might calm the tremors caused by the disease. She found relief in a new drug called Requip. "At first, the drug was like a miracle," Klinestiver says. "All my movement problems just disappeared." Over time, however, Klinestiver needed higher and higher doses of the drug in order to ease her symptoms. That's when she became a gambling addict. Although she'd never been interested in gambling before, Klinestiver was suddenly obsessed with slot machines. Every day, she would drive to the local dog racing track and play slots until 3:30 in the morning. After a year of addictive gambling, Klinestiver lost more than $200,000. Klinestiver's medication worked by imitating the effects of dopamine, a neurotransmitter in the brain. Parkinson's is caused by the death of dopamine neurons in brain areas that control bodily movement. But dopamine also plays a central role in the pleasure centers of the brain, influencing how we see the world and respond to it. Recent medical studies have found that anywhere from 3 to 13 percent of patients on the kind of medication Klinestiver was taking develop severe gambling addictions or related compulsions. In early 2006, Klinestiver was taken off Requip. Her tremors worsened, but her gambling addiction vanished. "I haven't gambled in 18 months," she says. "I still think about the slots, but the obsession isn't there." Stories like Klinestiver's, and research into dopamine's role in the brain, are helping neuroscientists understand the temptation of gambling and the scourge of gambling addiction. This research may also change the way we see casinos, and help shift the debate over whether the government should further regulate slots, roulette wheels, and other games of chance. From the perspective of the brain, gambling has much in common with addictive drugs, like cocaine. Both work by hijacking the brain's pleasure centers -- a lure that some people are literally incapable of resisting. "Gambling games grew up around the frailty of our nervous system," says Read Montague, a professor of neuroscience at Baylor University. "They evolved to exploit specific hiccups in our brain." In recent years, gambling has spread across America, with gambling generating revenues of $2.9 billion in New England in 2006. The question of gambling is of particular relevance for Massachusetts. Last month, the town of Middleborough voted in support of a massive new gambling complex, to be built on lands owned by the Mashpee Wampanoag tribe. Governor Deval Patrick is currently considering proposals to expand gambling across the state, and several developers are looking at sites in Boston. The growth of the gambling industry has been accompanied by a large amount of new scientific research explaining the effects of gambling on the brain. The neural circuits manipulated by gambling originally evolved to help animals assess rewards, such as food, that are crucial for survival. Dopamine is the neurotransmitter involved with the processing of these rewards. Whenever we experience something pleasurable, such as winning a hand of blackjack or eating a piece of chocolate cake, our dopamine neurons get excited. These neurons help the brain learn about the pleasure, and attempt to predict when it will happen again. Wolfram Schultz, a neuroscientist at Cambridge University, has exposed how this system operates on a molecular level. He has spent the last two decades measuring the activity of dopamine neurons in the brains of monkeys as they receive rewards of fruit juice. His experiments observe a simple protocol: Schultz flashes a light, waits a few seconds, and then squirts a few drops of apple juice into the monkey's mouth. While the monkeys are waiting for the sweet liquid, Schultz painstakingly monitors the response of individual cells. At first, the neurons don't get excited until the juice is delivered. The cells are reacting to the actual reward. However, once the animal learns that the light always precedes the arrival of juice, the same neurons begin firing at the sight of the light instead of the reward. Schultz calls these cells "prediction neurons," since they are more interested in predicting rewards than in the rewards themselves. These predictions are a crucial source of learning, since the monkey constantly compares its expectations of juice with what actually happens. For example, if the light is flashed but the juice never arrives, then the monkey's dopamine neurons stop firing. This is known as the "error signal." The monkey is disappointed, and begins to change its future predictions. However, if the monkey receives an unexpected reward -- the juice arrives without warning -- then the dopamine neurons get extremely excited. A surprising treat registers much larger than an expected one. "A reward that's unpredictable typically counts three or four times as much," Schultz says. Games of chance prey on this neural system. Consider, for example, the slot machine. You put in a coin and pull the lever. The reels start to whirr. Eventually, the machine settles on its verdict. Chances are you lost money. But think about the slot machine from the perspective of your dopamine neurons. Whenever you win some money, the reward activates those brain cells intent on anticipating future rewards. These neurons want to predict the patterns inside the machine, to decode the logic of luck. Yet here's the catch: slot machines can't be solved. They use random number generators to determine their payout. There are no patterns to decipher. There is only a little microchip, churning out arbitrary digits. At this point, our dopamine neurons should just turn themselves off: the slot machine is a waste of mental energy. But this isn't what happens. Instead of getting bored by the haphazard payouts, our dopamine neurons become obsessed. The random rewards of gambling are much more seductive than a more predictable reward cycle. When we pull the lever and win some money, we experience a potent rush of pleasurable dopamine precisely because the reward was so unexpected. The clanging coins and flashing lights are like a surprising squirt of juice. The end result is that we are transfixed by the slot machine, riveted by the fickle nature of its payouts. "The trick of a one-armed bandit," Montague says, "is that it provides us with the illusion of a pattern. We get enough rewards so that we keep on playing. Our cells think they'll figure out the pattern soon. But of course they won't." The irony of gambling is that it's entertaining because it's so frustrating, at least for our dopamine neurons. One of the big remaining questions for scientists is why only some gamblers get addicted. While most people can walk away from the slot machines, some gamblers, like Klinestiver, can't resist the temptation. For these compulsive gamblers, the misplaced predictions of their dopamine neurons become self-destructive. These people are so blinded by the pleasures of occasionally winning that they slowly lose everything. :ok

[braintest12]

Re: Betting for a living I just stumbled on this thread, very interesting to read, thank you, Mayfly. When you say: "My figures over the last five years have produced a profit of £5k -£7k a year from my part time hobby although some would say it’s hardly part time when it takes up all my non working hours. Many acquaintances question this figure as they fail to see why I can’t simply increase my stake accordingly and enjoy the good life, if only it was that easy." Can I ask you why is that? Why can't you simply increase your stakes and make a living?

[mayfly]

Re: Betting for a living Thanks braintest, I meant to answer that at that point but somehow moved on, its a question I've asked myself many a time. Its hard to convey the everyday problems I have betting to someone who may not have encountered the same. A big part of making a profit is getting the best prices and when my normal stake of 100-150 is reduced on a regular basis, upping that stake becomes even more problematic. Believe me I've tried the wheeling and dealing of chasing and missing prices to the point of utter frustration. Maybe sub-consciously I'm not prepared to leave my comfort zone or maybe its like everything else in life, one has a particular level of competence and I've reached mine. :ok

[gelkinwhite]

Re: Betting for a living thats it mayfly youve hit the spot,randomness and understanding it,picking winners isnt a science,we'd all be millionaires if that was true,our brains demand stimulation what ever your pleasure,casino's and bookmakers spend millions making our brains do what they want them to do......lose....but have a nice day doing it!i like to think i try to think different to the norm, facts, figures, trends, mind sets takes away most of the randomness of gambling,experience is a huge factor in this game. i myself proberly just like you have served my time, paid for my knowledge the hard way but eventually its slowly paying back,all i need these days is my laptop or a paper not a database or tip phone line.....then it begins...i love the game.....thats all it is numbers:D

[braintest12]

Re: Betting for a living Anyway, Mayfly, £5k -£7k a year is not bad and your ideas about betting and human brain are excellent. Even made me sign up, I've been lurking here for ages.

[Shy10ck]

Re: Betting for a living

I will keep this thread to post on the more psychological side of betting and start others specifically for a sport, the ODDSMAKER REQUIRED thread, which I’ll post in shortly will hopefully contain some benefit on Soccer betting. Thanks for all your good wishes. :ok

Has the ODDSMAKER REQUIRED thread been deleted? And if ... does anyone know why? It was, as this, a great thread.

[n.irelandpunter]

Re: Betting for a living very helpful thread full of differnt peoples valuble opinions :ok:ok:ok looking forward to hearing more

[pliusminus]

Re: Betting for a living

Thanks for your post its reminded me of one of the biggest myths we face' date=' LUCK. Its not luck that is the challenge but our ignorance in understanding how randomness works. Get these subjects on your side, understanding randomness and emotions go a long way to understanding your betting. :ok[/quote'] 100% agree.. i'm studying how human mind works, for about 2 year and your posts totaly confirm the information i have collected till now. great pleasure to read your posts. respect

[Shy10ck]

Re: Betting for a living Maybe so, but do not reject luck as an important feeling. We are humans trying to act perfect in an imperfect market. We are not machines and need reward for the many hours we spend, to find value in the market. :cheers when we win, and therefor :@ when we loose. If we feel LUCK or feel unfortunate. It might be sign of that we, for some reason, are are betting outside our comfort zone. And that we should react on. So in my opinion, feelings are very important for responsible betting. Listen to them.

[theblackswan]

One of the more interesting and challenging threads on here - read 'Fooled by Randomness' by Naseem Taleb - although it's generally based on the financial markets it is relevant to sports in terms of appreciating luck, control and various other factors...