Advice on staking plan for laying system

[kroni]

I've recently started laying horses alot more (can't seem to back any winners at the moment) and have come up with a system but not sure whether to use level stakes or vary the stake based on the price to win the same amount on each selection or a percentage of the bank. The prices im laying are anything up to 9/1 mostly above the 2/1 mark. Obviously the bigger priced selections are more successfull than the shorter priced so i'm not sure which stakes would benefit me more. Not sure if there are many layers on this forum but im sure some you can help, any other general advice on laying will be apprciated.

[The Saint]

Re: Advice on staking plan for laying system Not my work Kroni - but incredibly sound advice none the less. I still haven't started laying yet - still paper trading - but it's iminent!!! Good Luck with it - I think you should start a laying thread so I can see someone having some hopefu success before I take the plunge!! As a backer, my main concern is that I won;t be able to identify value when it comes to lays... Developing angles though!

Saint, good Sir I’ve been laying horses now for 8 years and do it full time. Based on what I read in your post, laying should be child’s play to you. It doesn’t require that you change your mind-set (which is difficult for most people), it requires that you just reverse it (which is much easier to achieve). You mention the search for value when you back. It is also the case when you lay. Let’s suppose that you select a horse to back. There are 3 possibilities: 1. It has zero value – in which case you don’t back it, I presume? NOR SHOULD YOU LAY IT EITHER because it has zero laying value. 2. It has positive backing value – in which case, you back it, I presume? You should not lay these horses because they have negative laying value. 3. It has negative backing value – in which case you don’t back it, I presume? BUT, YOU SHOULD LAY IT because it has laying value. If you can find value when you back, it should be easy for you to find value when you lay. I suggest that you lay to level stakes – I do. If you are disciplined when backing, I see no reason why you shouldn’t be disciplined when laying. As for stakes – paper trade first then start laying with small stakes and gradually increase in line with your confidence. To determine you liability, decide what the max exchange odds are that you are prepared to lay at. Subtract 1 and divide the result into £100. This will give you your liability per bet. As for max odds – I don’t lay if the odds are > 6.0 because the ROI is not worth the risk if the odds are high. I look for over-bet favourites, former course/distance winners and false favourites so I usually stick to the 1st 3 in the betting where there's plenty of liquidity and plenty numpties willing to shovel shed loads on no-hopers and back them down to silly-stupid odds. Also, if I take a hit, it doesn't take long to get my money back. If I layed long-shots, it would take forever to get the money back and by the time I did, I'd probably get hit again. This (twatting) weather is great for laying – long may it continue. The results are all over the place. It’s a layer’s paradise at the moment. Life for layers gets more difficult the better the ground. That’s because racing gets more consistent. Last spring, during the dry weather, I got creamed. As for the number of selections: For every horse that has positive backing value, there’s a horse or horses with equivalent laying value. If this were not the case, the markets wouldn’t be as perfect as they are. So, for every horse that you would normally back, there’s one horse that can be profitably layed. Hope that this helps.