Flop Quads, How do I play it?

[deadlydaveLDN]

CO is playing 35/27, and UTG 60/18 Grabbed by Holdem Manager NL Holdem $1(BB) Replayer SB ($158) BB ($76.50) UTG ($265) CO ($121) Hero ($139) Dealt to Hero J Q UTG calls $1, CO raises to $5, Hero calls $5, fold, fold, UTG calls $4 FLOP ($16.50) J J J Flop the nuts, how do I get the money?

[billy the punter]

Re: Flop Quads, How do I play it? Bet out, then slow play. Live I'd be doing allsorts to get paid, checking in the dark on the turn after any flop action etc.

[AJ]

Re: Flop Quads, How do I play it? yeah, you need to put out a very standard looking C bet here. You're praying some is holding AA here.

[Paul176]

Re: Flop Quads, How do I play it? Just bet bet bet and pray they have a decent pocket pair that they can't fold.

[ubermonkey1]

Re: Flop Quads, How do I play it? yeah bet out:ok not too big ,half pot size etc and see where it goes from there, with 2 players in :hopesomeone or both have a pp. as billy says from there sloplay as much as possible till the river.you have position as well, so at least you can get a value bet in if things do slow up too much.

[Nade]

Re: Flop Quads, How do I play it? UTG is a huge fish and could have any 2 cards, CO's bet looks like a normal isolation raise so he could have any 2 cards also but slightly smaller range. So IMO they have PP's way way less than they have random hands like 89s and A6o for e.g. Also your hand looks like a PP so if they check to you and you bet you'll barely ever get action from CO. It's a judgement call on how bad you think the fish is, are they going to call a flop bet with any 2 cards? if so bet, but do they shut down post flop? if so check and hope they hit as they'll pay you off massively if they do hit. If CO bets flop then they have at least medium sized PP if not big PP so then it comes down to how tight you're playing. If you're a nit and re-raise this flop then i doubt you'll get 3 streets of value even from QQ, maybe AA but CO is playing 35/27 so looks like a spew monkey and will pay off with the biggest pairs. You're last to act on the flop so it's only easy to comment after you show us what the other 2 have done ;).

[ubermonkey1]

Re: Flop Quads, How do I play it?

You're last to act on the flop so it's only easy to comment after you show us what the other 2 have done ;).

thats a very good point,a lot depends on how the first 2 act.if they start out aggro then id play it nice and slow and just keep calling(hoping both stay in)if they check check then i'd revert my original plan of half pot. ps how on earth do you know utg is a huge fish:unsure okay he looks pretty loose passive but maybe the CO or daves line so far has made him play like it. maybe your right about both having any 2, if so your not gonna make a lot anyway:\id rather take the chance and hopefully make a lot out of it:hope

[Nade]

Re: Flop Quads, How do I play it?

thats a very good point,a lot depends on how the first 2 act.if they start out aggro then id play it nice and slow and just keep calling(hoping both stay in)if they check check then i'd revert my original plan of half pot. ps how on earth do you know utg is a huge fish:unsure okay he looks pretty loose passive but maybe the CO or daves line so far has made him play like it. maybe your right about both having any 2, if so your not gonna make a lot anyway:\id rather take the chance and hopefully make a lot out of it:hope

Sample size is an issue (we don't know how many hands we have on UTG) but any player playing 60% of hands is a fish. Durrrr and Ivey are the only two who can play over 40% profitably and there's noone at this level who can play over 30% of hands profitably over a decent sample so straight away you can tell who the fish are. His action says a lot too, open limping UTG then calling a solid isolate OOP is just burning money. FWIW calling $5 OOP with QJs is also burning money as we're OOP in a solid sized pot without the initiative - that's going to be a collosal leak in the long run.

[deadlydaveLDN]

Re: Flop Quads, How do I play it?

FWIW calling $5 OOP with QJs is also burning money as we're OOP in a solid sized pot without the initiative - that's going to be a collosal leak in the long run.

Lucky that we're on the button then ;)

[deadlydaveLDN]

Re: Flop Quads, How do I play it? Here's how the hand went anyway. (It was checked to me on the flop, I probably should have mentioned that :lol) The huge fish was 60/18 over 92 hands btw. Grabbed by Holdem Manager NL Holdem $1(BB) Replayer SB ($158) BB ($76.50) UTG ($265) CO ($121) Hero ($139) Dealt to Hero J Q UTG calls $1, CO raises to $5, Hero calls $5, fold, fold, UTG calls $4 FLOP ($16.50) J J J UTG checks, CO checks, Hero bets $10, UTG calls $10, CO folds TURN ($36.50) J J J 2 UTG checks, Hero bets $25, UTG calls $25 RIVER ($86.50) J J J 2 T UTG checks, Hero bets ??? I think I played it right until the river, how much would you bet here?

[ubermonkey1]

Re: Flop Quads, How do I play it?

Sample size is an issue (we don't know how many hands we have on UTG) but any player playing 60% of hands is a fish.

ah didnt see that ,yep big fat fish:ok

[Nade]

Re: Flop Quads, How do I play it?

Lucky that we're on the button then ;)

Oh yeh, 3hrs between my first 2 posts and i forgot :lol:lol

Here's how the hand went anyway. (It was checked to me on the flop, I probably should have mentioned that :lol) The huge fish was 60/18 over 92 hands btw. Grabbed by Holdem Manager NL Holdem $1(BB) Replayer SB ($158) BB ($76.50) UTG ($265) CO ($121) Hero ($139) Dealt to Hero J Q UTG calls $1, CO raises to $5, Hero calls $5, fold, fold, UTG calls $4 FLOP ($16.50) J J J UTG checks, CO checks, Hero bets $10, UTG calls $10, CO folds TURN ($36.50) J J J 2 UTG checks, Hero bets $25, UTG calls $25 RIVER ($86.50) J J J 2 T UTG checks, Hero bets ??? I think I played it right until the river, how much would you bet here?

I said this in another post the other day but the same applies: bet more on turn so we have a pot sized pet left on river at most i.e. we don't have to over-shove to get all the money in which looks scarier. The way it is the pot is $85 and we have $100. The simplest thing to think about is UTG either has a full house or total air (obviously). It's really unlikely a 2 has improved their hand but they still call so we can probably assume they have a PP so i like shoving the river for max value as the fish will hate folding a full house quite simply 9/10 times they'll call with any PP. As a querky other option i like the 'gay' bet as championed by david benefield :lol that's where we bet like $15 on the river to induce a spaz out shove from a fish who has total air. A value bet of like $40 i like the least as it looks so strong and i think if they're going to call $40 they'll call an all in anyway. WP though so far apart from slightly small bet size on turn imo :ok

[deadlydaveLDN]

Re: Flop Quads, How do I play it?

I said this in another post the other day but the same applies: bet more on turn so we have a pot sized pet left on river at most i.e. we don't have to over-shove to get all the money in which looks scarier. The way it is the pot is $85 and we have $100. The simplest thing to think about is UTG either has a full house or total air (obviously). It's really unlikely a 2 has improved their hand but they still call so we can probably assume they have a PP so i like shoving the river for max value as the fish will hate folding a full house quite simply 9/10 times they'll call with any PP. As a querky other option i like the 'gay' bet as championed by david benefield :lol that's where we bet like $15 on the river to induce a spaz out shove from a fish who has total air. A value bet of like $40 i like the least as it looks so strong and i think if they're going to call $40 they'll call an all in anyway. WP though so far apart from slightly small bet size on turn imo :ok

I was going to wait for more people to reply, but you seem to have covered all options (including the gay bet that I didn't consider). Like you, I really don't like the value bet, as he's going to call all in 99% of the time that he's going to call $40 in this spot. Grabbed by Holdem Manager NL Holdem $1(BB) Replayer SB ($158) BB ($76.50) UTG ($265) CO ($121) Hero ($139) Dealt to Hero J Q UTG calls $1, CO raises to $5, Hero calls $5, fold, fold, UTG calls $4 FLOP ($16.50) J J J UTG checks, CO checks, Hero bets $10, UTG calls $10, CO folds TURN ($36.50) J J J 2 UTG checks, Hero bets $25, UTG calls $25 RIVER ($86.50) J J J 2 T UTG checks, Hero bets $99.40 (AI), UTG folds Hero shows J Q Hero wins $83.50 Like Nade says, I probably should have sized my bets in such a way that I could ship it all in on the river. I think the fact that we were effectively playing 139BB stacks meant that I should have increased my regualr c-bet sizes on flop and/or turn. I went for the shove because a) I thought if he's holding and decent pocket pair he's calling any bet b) I thought it might look a bit bluffy. Maybe to a fish though it looks more scary than bluffy. I actually managed to flop quad Aces today (holding AA) and played it pretty badly against a shortstack, so may post that up at some point.

[deadlydaveLDN]

Re: Flop Quads, How do I play it? Note : It says I showed JdQd, I didn't actually show, not sure why it says I did. I never do unless I'm playing with people I know.