Understanding ICM analysis in Coolers

[GaF]

Re: Understanding ICM analysis in Coolers Ok - next question then ;) from a purely mathematical ICM perspective - which hands could you shove with positive expectation?

[robilaruk]

Re: Understanding ICM analysis in Coolers

Ok - next question then ;) from a purely mathematical ICM perspective - which hands could you shove with positive expectation?

that surely depends on chip stack to blinds ratio including position? :hope am a bit confused as this is a very open-ended question :unsure Damo

[GaF]

Re: Understanding ICM analysis in Coolers

that surely depends on chip stack to blinds ratio including position? :hope

You have that information - I'm refering specifically to the last hand

am a bit confused as this is a very open-ended question :unsure Damo

Would it make more sense if I asked what range of hands you would call his (assumed) all in with? :$

[GaF]

Re: Understanding ICM analysis in Coolers Damo - here's the output from SNGPT for the hand (and answer to the last question) If he shoves with any two cards, you can see that folding gives you equity of $1.44 (same as you have - but you listed payout as $1 instead of $2) and calling gives you equity of $1.24 (very very close to your number). We can also see that in the BB here, we can only put all our chips in with QQ, KK and AA if he shoves with any two.

[robilaruk]

Re: Understanding ICM analysis in Coolers

We can also see that in the BB here, we can only put all our chips in with QQ, KK and AA if he shoves with any two.

thanks GaF - thinking about it afterwards I thought you meant the 77 hand. Glad to see I was close with my assumption of what I would play against the raiser - Queens seems obvious, but part of me still wants to fold them....... This is a very good example of a +ev situation (;)), where the BB can only have 3 hands to call a shove. Perhaps ev is your next topic:ok Damo

[robilaruk]

Re: Understanding ICM analysis in Coolers Can we use ICM here? Villians shoving range is huge, blinds are big and he is UTG Yes/No? Damo ***** Hand 1336382752 ***** 150.00/300.00 Texas Hold'em (No Limit ) - 25 November 2008 22:21:46 Cooler (Real /Tournament ) Seat 1: Taurus1985 (2620.00) Seat 2: Turbala (1295.00) Seat 3: asgr76 (2450.00) Seat 4: lomurrid10 (3090.00) Seat 5: Unknown (0.00) Seat 6: Unknown (0.00) Seat 7: robilaruk (2345.00) Seat 8: llunatic1 (610.00) Seat 9: Unknown (0.00) Seat 10: RINNERTJE7 (2590.00) RINNERTJE7 post SB 150.00 Taurus1985 post BB 300.00** Deal ** robilaruk [8c, 8d] *** Bet Round 1 *** Turbala All-in 1295.00 asgr76 Fold lomurrid10 Fold

[GaF]

Re: Understanding ICM analysis in Coolers

Can we use ICM here?

Easy with holdemresources.net ;) http://www.holdemresources.net/hr/sngs/icmcalculator.html?action=calculate&bb=300&sb=150&ante=0&structure=0.2%2C0.2%2C0.2%2C0.2%2C0.2&s1=1295&s2=2450&s3=3090&s4=2345&s5=610&s6=2590&s7=2620&s8=&s9= Level: 150.0/300.0/0.0 Structure: 0.2/0.2/0.2/0.2/0.2 Players: 7 Runtime: 1490ms [300 Iterations]

Player	Stack	Push%	EQPre	EQPost	EQDiff
UTG	1295.0	27.9%	0.114	0.1161	0.00214
UTG+1	2450.0	63.7%	0.1614	0.1631	0.00172
UTG+2	3090.0	73.6%	0.1739	0.1748	8.7E-4
CO	2345.0	78.3%	0.1587	0.1598	0.00106
BU	610.0	24.6%	0.062	0.0653	0.00325
SB	2590.0	100.0%	0.1647	0.1622	-0.00251
BB	2620.0		0.1653	0.1588	-0.00654

Explanation:

• Stack: Players stack before posting blinds.
• Push%: Percentage of hands a player open-pushes.
• EQPre: ICM equity before blinds.
• EQPost: ICM equity after hand.
• EQDiff: ICM equity change during hand.

PU	CA	OC	Range
UTG			27.9%, 22+ A2s+ A7o+ A5o K6s+ KTo+ Q8s+ QTo+ J8s+ JTo T8s+ 97s+ 87s
	UTG+1		1.8%, JJ+
		UTG+2	0.5%, AA
		CO	0.5%, AA
		BU	0.5%, AA
		SB	0.5%, AA
		BB	0.5%, AA
	UTG+2		2.1%, JJ+ AKs
		CO	0.5%, AA
		BU	0.9%, KK+
		SB	0.5%, AA
		BB	0.5%, AA
	CO		2.1%, JJ+ AKs
		BU	0.9%, KK+
		SB	0.5%, AA
		BB	0.5%, AA
	BU		12.4%, 55+ A8s+ A9o+ KJs+ KQo
		SB	4.2%, 99+ AQs+ AKo
		BB	7.1%, 88+ ATs+ AJo+
	SB		5.4%, 99+ AJs+ AQo+
		BB	0.5%, AA
	BB		9.0%, 77+ A9s+ ATo+ KQs
UTG+1			63.7%, AA 22+ Kx+ Q2s+ Q8o+ J2s+ J8o+ T3s+ T7o+ 93s+ 97o+ 84s+ 86o+ 73s+ 75o+ 63s+ 65o 52s+ 54o 43s
	UTG+2		0.5%, AA
		CO	0.5%, AA
		BU	0.5%, AA
		SB	0.5%, AA
		BB	0.5%, AA
	CO		0.5%, AA
		BU	0.5%, AA
		SB	0.5%, AA
		BB	0.5%, AA
	BU		27.8%, 33+ Ax+ K6s+ K9o+ Q9s+ QJo JTs
		SB	0.9%, KK+
		BB	0.9%, KK+
	SB		0.9%, KK+
		BB	0.5%, AA
	BB		0.9%, KK+
UTG+2			73.6%, AA 22+ Kx+ Q2s+ Q4o+ J2s+ J7o+ T2s+ T6o+ 92s+ 96o+ 82s+ 85o+ 73s+ 75o+ 62s+ 64o+ 52s+ 54o 42s+
	CO		0.5%, AA
		BU	0.5%, AA
		SB	0.5%, AA
		BB	0.5%, AA
	BU		32.3%, 33+ Ax+ K4s+ K7o+ Q8s+ Q9o+ JTs
		SB	0.5%, AA
		BB	0.9%, KK+
	SB		0.5%, AA
		BB	0.5%, AA
	BB		0.9%, KK+
CO			78.3%, 22+ Kx+ Q2s+ Q3o+ J2s+ J5o+ T2s+ T6o+ 92s+ 95o+ 82s+ 85o+ 72s+ 75o+ 62s+ 64o+ 52s+ 54o 42s+ 32s
	BU		34.7%, 33+ Ax+ K3s+ K6o+ Q8s+ Q9o+ J9s+ JTo
		SB	1.4%, QQ+
		BB	1.4%, QQ+
	SB		0.9%, KK+
		BB	0.5%, AA
	BB		1.4%, QQ+
BU			24.6%, 22+ A2s+ A8o+ K7s+ KJo+ Q8s+ QTo+ J8s+ JTo T8s+ 98s 87s
	SB		37.6%, 22+ Ax+ K2s+ K6o+ Q6s+ Q9o+ J8s+ JTo T8s+ 98s 87s
		BB	0.5%, AA
	BB		100.0%, Any two
SB			100.0%, Any two
	BB		1.4%, QQ+

Explanation:

• PU: Pushing Player. Applies when no other player entered the pot yet.
• CA: Calling Player. Player pushes after another player (PU) is already in the pot.
• OC: OverCalling Player. Player pushes after two other players (PU, CA) are already in the pot.

The villains shove range should be something like: 27.9%, 22+ A2s+ A7o+ A5o K6s+ KTo+ Q8s+ QTo+ J8s+ JTo T8s+ 97s+ 87s However your call range is pretty small: 2.1%, JJ+ AKs

[robilaruk]