The power of the minimum bet

[GaF]

Look away now Heniek :tongue2 Now, before the high rollers* come on here telling me what a crap strategy it is - I KNOW!! I know it's bad poker and not profitable (in general) - these comments are specific to the 5c/10c benchmarking tables that we are playing.... I have just tried relentlessly minimum raising and been absolutely stunned at how many pots I've taken down. Players dont seem to notice whether I'm betting 10c into a $5 pot or $5 into a $5 pot - so relentlessly min betting until a big hand is hit, then pot sized bets appears, at first glance, to be working well :loon * high rollers = anyone playing 12c/25c or higher.

[jakkace]

Re: The power of the minimum raise

Look away now Heniek :tongue2 Now, before the high rollers* come on here telling me what a crap strategy it is - I KNOW!! I know it's bad poker and not profitable (in general) - these comments are specific to the 5c/10c benchmarking tables that we are playing.... I have just tried relentlessly minimum raising and been absolutely stunned at how many pots I've taken down. Players dont seem to notice whether I'm betting 10c into a $5 pot or $5 into a $5 pot - so relentlessly min betting until a big hand is hit, then pot sized bets appears, at first glance, to be working well :loon * high rollers = anyone playing 12c/25c or higher.

Try using weird bet sizes to tilt other players, like $1.23,$2.22 etc etc works a lot at lower limits.

[ubermonkey1]

Re: The power of the minimum raise

Look away now Heniek :tongue2 Now, before the high rollers* come on here telling me what a crap strategy it is - I KNOW!! I know it's bad poker and not profitable (in general) - these comments are specific to the 5c/10c benchmarking tables that we are playing.... I have just tried relentlessly minimum raising and been absolutely stunned at how many pots I've taken down. Players dont seem to notice whether I'm betting 10c into a $5 pot or $5 into a $5 pot - so relentlessly min betting until a big hand is hit, then pot sized bets appears, at first glance, to be working well :loon * high rollers = anyone playing 12c/25c or higher.

:puke nah in all fairness at this level (which i still play occasionally to boost my kings account ,even tho i'm a high roller:tongue2)maths etc can go completely out the window for some/most:loon so if it's working then go with it:ok

[GaF]

Re: The power of the minimum raise These are my results tonight playing this way, which, trust me ;), are a significant improvement over my results previously. It's not pretty, but it's damn effective - I'm amazed how much information it gives you too!! I'll dig out some hands to demonstrate exactly what I'm getting away with :loon

[GaF]

Re: The power of the minimum raise BossMedia Game #1449351954: Table Table TH 772 - €0.05/€0.10 - No Limit Hold'em - 22:14:11 - 2009/02/08 Seat 4: PLTelepee (€10.12) Seat 5: jinete10 (€19.64) Seat 1: 1kkdollars (€4.44) Seat 2: xuigun (€9.90) Seat 3: F1shKiller (€8.68) jinete10 posts the small blind of €0.05 1kkdollars posts the big blind of €0.10 PLTelepee is the button *** HOLE CARDS *** Dealt to PLTelepee [:8s: :Ac:] xuigun calls €0.10 F1shKiller folds PLTelepee raises €0.45 jinete10 folds 1kkdollars folds xuigun calls €0.45 *** FLOP *** [:Qs: :6c: :3h:] xuigun checks PLTelepee bets €0.10 xuigun folds *** SUMMARY *** Total pot €1.00 | Rake €0.05 Board: [Qs 6c 3h] 1kkdollars won (€0.00), mucks xuigun won (€0.00), mucks F1shKiller won (€0.00), mucks PLTelepee won (€1.00), mucks jinete10 won (€0.00), mucks

[GaF]

Re: The power of the minimum raise BossMedia Game #1449349160: Table Table TH 772 - €0.05/€0.10 - No Limit Hold'em - 22:12:38 - 2009/02/08 Seat 1: 1kkdollars (€4.94) Seat 4: PLTelepee (€9.67) Seat 5: jinete10 (€19.74) Seat 3: F1shKiller (€8.48) PLTelepee posts the big blind of €0.10 F1shKiller posts the small blind of €0.05 1kkdollars is the button *** HOLE CARDS *** Dealt to PLTelepee [:Ad: :Th:] jinete10 folds 1kkdollars raises €0.30 F1shKiller folds PLTelepee calls €0.30 *** FLOP *** [:3h: :Jh: :2s:] PLTelepee bets €0.10 1kkdollars calls €0.10 *** TURN *** [3h Jh 2s] [:6h:] PLTelepee bets €0.10 1kkdollars calls €0.10 *** RIVER *** [3h Jh 2s 6h] [:4s:] PLTelepee bets €0.60 1kkdollars folds *** SUMMARY *** Total pot €1.00 | Rake €0.05 Board: [3h Jh 2s 6h 4s] 1kkdollars won (€0.00), mucks F1shKiller won (€0.00), mucks PLTelepee won (€1.00), mucks jinete10 won (€0.00), mucks

[GaF]

Re: The power of the minimum raise BossMedia Game #1449366162: Table Table TH 772 - €0.05/€0.10 - No Limit Hold'em - 22:22:11 - 2009/02/08 Seat 2: xuigun (€9.43) Seat 3: F1shKiller (€7.43) Seat 4: PLTelepee (€12.56) Seat 5: jinete10 (€19.44) Seat 1: 1kkdollars (€3.64) F1shKiller posts the small blind of €0.05 PLTelepee posts the big blind of €0.10 1kkdollars posts the dead blind of €0.15 xuigun is the button *** HOLE CARDS *** Dealt to PLTelepee [:4h: :5c:] jinete10 folds 1kkdollars checks xuigun calls €0.10 F1shKiller calls €0.10 PLTelepee checks *** FLOP *** [:3d: :3c: :7d:] F1shKiller checks PLTelepee bets €0.10 1kkdollars calls €0.10 xuigun folds F1shKiller folds *** TURN *** [3d 3c 7d] [:9d:] PLTelepee bets €0.40 1kkdollars folds *** SUMMARY *** Total pot €0.62 | Rake €0.03 Board: [3d 3c 7d 9d] 1kkdollars won (€0.00), mucks xuigun won (€0.00), mucks F1shKiller won (€0.00), mucks PLTelepee won (€0.62), mucks jinete10 won (€0.00), mucks

[GaF]

Re: The power of the minimum raise BossMedia Game #1449348280: Table Table TH 772 - €0.05/€0.10 - No Limit Hold'em - 22:12:11 - 2009/02/08 Seat 1: 1kkdollars (€4.99) Seat 4: PLTelepee (€9.30) Seat 5: jinete10 (€19.74) Seat 3: F1shKiller (€8.83) 1kkdollars posts the small blind of €0.05 F1shKiller posts the big blind of €0.10 jinete10 is the button *** HOLE CARDS *** Dealt to PLTelepee [:7s: :7c:] PLTelepee raises €0.35 jinete10 folds 1kkdollars folds F1shKiller calls €0.35 *** FLOP *** [:Jc: :4s: :Kc:] F1shKiller checks PLTelepee bets €0.10 F1shKiller folds *** SUMMARY *** Total pot €0.72 | Rake €0.03 Board: [Jc 4s Kc] 1kkdollars won (€0.00), mucks F1shKiller won (€0.00), mucks PLTelepee won (€0.72), mucks jinete10 won (€0.00), mucks

[GaF]

Re: The power of the minimum raise BossMedia Game #1449304565: Table Table TH 465 - €0.05/€0.10 - No Limit Hold'em - 21:48:45 - 2009/02/08 Seat 1: Suanito85 (€10.58) Seat 2: Lucky_Ed (€9.94) Seat 3: PLTelepee (€13.26) Seat 4: Alburnus (€8.51) Seat 5: BEGINNERA (€9.69) Alburnus posts the big blind of €0.10 PLTelepee posts the small blind of €0.05 Lucky_Ed is the button *** HOLE CARDS *** Dealt to PLTelepee [:Qc: :Kh:] BEGINNERA folds Suanito85 raises €0.20 Lucky_Ed folds PLTelepee calls €0.20 Alburnus calls €0.20 *** FLOP *** [:8h: :6c: :5h:] PLTelepee bets €0.10 Alburnus calls €0.10 Suanito85 folds *** TURN *** [8h 6c 5h] [:Qd:] PLTelepee bets €0.60 Alburnus calls €0.60 *** RIVER *** [8h 6c 5h Qd] [:Tc:] PLTelepee bets €0.10 Alburnus folds *** SUMMARY *** Total pot €1.90 | Rake €0.10 Board: [8h 6c 5h Qd Tc] Suanito85 won (€0.00), mucks Lucky_Ed won (€0.00), mucks PLTelepee won (€1.90), mucks Alburnus won (€0.00), mucks BEGINNERA won (€0.00), mucks

[GaF]

Re: The power of the minimum raise BossMedia Game #1449321261: Table Table TH 465 - €0.05/€0.10 - No Limit Hold'em - 21:57:27 - 2009/02/08 Seat 2: Lucky_Ed (€9.88) Seat 3: PLTelepee (€14.33) Seat 1: Suanito85 (€10.41) Seat 4: Alburnus (€6.40) Seat 5: BEGINNERA (€10.57) Lucky_Ed posts the big blind of €0.10 Suanito85 posts the small blind of €0.05 BEGINNERA is the button *** HOLE CARDS *** Dealt to PLTelepee [:Qd: :Jd:] PLTelepee raises €0.35 Alburnus calls €0.35 BEGINNERA calls €0.35 Suanito85 folds Lucky_Ed folds *** FLOP *** [:9c: :8d: :3h:] PLTelepee bets €0.10 Alburnus calls €0.10 BEGINNERA calls €0.10 *** TURN *** [9c 8d 3h] [:6d:] PLTelepee bets €0.10 Alburnus folds BEGINNERA folds *** SUMMARY *** Total pot €1.43 | Rake €0.07 Board: [9c 8d 3h 6d] Suanito85 won (€0.00), mucks Lucky_Ed won (€0.00), mucks PLTelepee won (€1.43), mucks Alburnus won (€0.00), mucks BEGINNERA won (€0.00), mucks I wont bother posting anymore - but honestly - this is just the tip of the iceberg - min raising is the future, min raising is the way to go :tongue2

[ubermonkey1]

Re: The power of the minimum raise blimy :loon:loonhave you got some kind of fish magnet running,it's usually bad at this level but this is beyond a joke:)

[GaF]

Re: The power of the minimum raise lol - it was like that across multiple tables with multiple opponents (indeed most opponents) - I havent even cherry picked the hands there - just the first ones I came to :loon

[Nade]

Re: The power of the minimum raise I think it needs to be clarified as a min bet not a min raise firstly ;);) secondly, you might be a genius. Keep it up :lol

[billy the punter]

Re: The power of the minimum raise Well I'm not a fan of min-betting, but I have no experience at the levels we're talking about above. I do have thoughts on min-RAISING though and I was going to write a peice of this tactic the other week but never got around to it. A few years ago I would not entertain the idea of min-raising, I mouthed off at lengths rubbishing such a move - however, experience brings knowledge and I've since flip-flopped. The min-raise, or the understanding of it, is very important to your game. And not just at the micro-limits mentioned above. In high quality games too. Pre-flop it's horrible and only suits the original bettor/raiser. But on the flop/turn/river it's a different story... Point 1 When facing a min-raise, at any, level alarm bells should ring - many players (although it's less common towards to the top bracket) will min-raise with a nut or near to nut hand. I've saved a lot of money passing strong (but vunerable hands) to a min-raise. 77 on a 623 board, or AQ on a AJ2 board for example. From my experience the min-bet is to be feared, apart from one instance.... Point 2 When playing decent players, ones that may understand point one, min-raising can be a great bluffing tool. Obviously you have to pick your spots, or more importantly, your player. A min-raise nearly always looks like you're milking with a monster. I played a big hand against RDW two or three years ago, he bet close to the pot on the river after a 4th club fell, I min-raised with nothing and got him to pass a flush. Now he was getting massive odds to call but my bet looked to him like I wanted a call, of course it did. I honestly believe that sometimes a bluff works better like this. You really have to know your opponent though, and to what level he is thinking at. I was able to make this play because I rated my opponent. Point 3 Sometimes in a raised pot, especially if I've not been the aggressor, I may min-raise if I've hit big. For example if I called a raise and hit top two (on non-draw flop) or better I may min-raise the aggressor's continuation bet. Some players with call this raise with mere overcards due to pride, image, or an attempt to catch. Many times I've min-raised with my trips, the players as called and his AK hit the turn and I get paid. You obviously need to have a lock hand in order to do this though. TT on a 528 board is not the sort of hand I mean for example. A flat call can obviously work just as well but if there is a another player in the middle I will always favour the min-raise. Besides a flat call can show your hand up, a min-raise may look to some opponents that you're trying to "find where you are" with top pair. Obviously I won't be able to use this if I ever face any of you lot!

[GaF]

Re: The power of the minimum raise

I think it needs to be clarified as a min bet not a min raise firstly ;);)

Fair comment :ok Title changed :ok Doesnt seem to be working in the same way tonight :unsure Maybe it's a weekend thing :unsure Having said that, it's still seeming very very useful (profitable ;) ) as a probe, as a block, to provide information and to induce bluffs.....

[Dave488]

Re: The power of the minimum bet This one made me laugh, obvious the other guy had been ready this eh Gaf, was calling for a bit of info really, didn't expect to win it!:eek BossMedia Game #1451758529: Table Table TH 109 - €0.05/€0.10 - No Limit Hold'em - 15:51:14 - 2009/02/10 Seat 2: Nisti77 (€2.27) Seat 3: PLdave488 (€9.24) Seat 5: anaxa (€1.90) Seat 1: ustuz (€12.78) Seat 4: benimiþte (€4.81) anaxa posts the small blind of €0.05 ustuz posts the big blind of €0.10 benimiþte is the button *** HOLE CARDS *** Dealt to PLdave488 [4h 7h] Nisti77 calls €0.10 PLdave488 calls €0.10 benimiþte raises €0.20 anaxa calls €0.20 ustuz calls €0.20 Nisti77 calls €0.20 PLdave488 calls €0.20 *** FLOP *** [9h Tc 8d] anaxa bets €0.10 ustuz calls €0.10 Nisti77 folds PLdave488 calls €0.10 benimiþte calls €0.10 *** TURN *** [9h Tc 8d] [Ts] anaxa checks ustuz checks PLdave488 checks benimiþte checks *** RIVER *** [9h Tc 8d Ts] [4s] anaxa checks ustuz checks PLdave488 checks benimiþte bets €0.10 anaxa folds ustuz folds PLdave488 calls €0.10 *** SUMMARY *** Total pot €1.52 | Rake €0.08 Board: [9h Tc 8d Ts 4s] ustuz won (€0.00), mucks Nisti77 won (€0.00), mucks PLdave488 won (€1.52), showed [4h 7h] benimiþte won (€0.00), showed [3s 3h] anaxa won (€0.00), mucks