Dodger Posted February 4, 2006 Share Posted February 4, 2006 If you can, read the article in March issue of Inside Edge. {If you can get a copy that is, not if you can read!} Excellent article which goes a long way to explain why some players feel there is a problem and explains quite clearly why there is not. Particularly like the last line of the following article where, after an evening of live poker one of the players says... ''Sod this, I'm off home to play on line. It's more realistic.'' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePro19 Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? lol. he was obviously playing against other online players live and couldn't cope because it's not fixed. Like i've already asked in another post, someone tell me where there is a poker pro playing (not just promoting) online and i'll go to that site; I've yet to see one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valiant23 Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? Well phillosify is a professional poker player.:ok So Pro, if I go to a casino or poker club and suffer bad beat after bad beat is that because I'm being cheated? I don't understand why almost every post is the same. Even Danno finds other things to complain about. We are ALL online players, have ALL suffered and inflicted bad beats. Some sites are better than others and someone tell me where there is a poker pro playing (not just promoting) online and i'll go to that site; I've yet to see one. is rubbish. Tony Kendall plays on Sporting Odds, Joe Hatchem on PokerStars, The Hendon Mob (for not much longer) play across the Prima network, Chris Moneymaker on PokerStars was (I think) an internet qualifier when he won the WSOP. I may be the only one who is finding the whinging tone of your posts tiresome, but by and large the Poker section on PL is a pretty happy place, and I don't think it would matter if you were sat with Gus Hansen, Doyle Brunson, Phil Helmuth, Phil Ivey and Mike Matusow you would STILL complain. Obviously all the consistent online money winners are just lucky or muppets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slapdash Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? I read the Inside Edge article today. I believe online poker (on the sites most people would regard as "reputable", anyway) is not fixed. But if I had believed otherwise, then I can't say there was much in the article that would have changed my mind, to be honest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danno375 Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? mr valiant is from now on to be known as mr valium Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robilaruk Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? Well I for one agree 100% with what Mr V said. Why would a poker site fix anything? whats the point? they earn so much they don't need to. and can I suggest that anyone who really believes sites are fixed not play on them or any others? coz why would you give your cash to thieves? now can we stop this poker is fixed bullshit please? Cheers Damo :cheers mr valiant is from now on to be known as mr valium Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danno375 Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? damo...... people have enjoyed conspiracy theory for years........ ranting at them won't stop it. so take some of your own advice..... if you don't think poker sites would fix games (regardless of if they do or could) then don't read the posts. simple as that. why people who play and pay is exactly the same as you lot who feel like the moral guardians of poker sites and shout down the conspiracy theorists. if you want to chat about it then feel free to post on the subject but if you don't like the subject matter... read something else!!! lmao! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Football-Tipper Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? children children for the love of god STOP IT... Cant we just live in a bad beat free world where everyone splits pots as to not upset each other... I HAVE A DREAM :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danno375 Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? split lip is the only thing you will get from me tipper! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robilaruk Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? some good points there matey however...... I think the problem with the "everything is fixed, so don't waste your money post" is that it discourages new players onto the scene - bad mouthing will drive people away, most of whom will pay my bills, some will take my cash to pay theirs..... :sad :lol and ignoring the bollocks about conspricy theory etc - why bother posting that shite in the first place? - if I really believed someone was stealing from me and I could stop it I would - I wouldn't say it and then carry on letting them take my money - that is seriously daft, in which case they need some help;) Just my thoughts Damo damo...... people have enjoyed conspiracy theory for years........ ranting at them won't stop it. lmao! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robilaruk Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? LOL :lol Damo split lip is the only thing you will get from me tipper! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Football-Tipper Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? split lip is the only thing you will get from me tipper! OOOooooooo look at you :rollin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePro19 Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? Why do I keep playing when I think games are fixed??? Because I can't stop! I enjoy playing poker. Playing live games means not getting to bed before 5am if I do well, and as I have to work during the day this is not an option. Whenever I can I find something else to do, but unfortunately, when I get back home I can't resist going back online. Found something to take my mind off it for a while... Manic Miner. Played that donkeys years ago on the Commodore 64. Now got it on the PC. Brings back memories. Of the 150 or so posts I've put in, about 10-20 only are about cheating and fixing. I believe it is, and until someone shows me the code my mind will not be changed. And anyway, I'm not the one who started the thread, I just added to it... yes, the same 'tiresome posts' as my others... but then you don't have to read it. :moon Oh, and finally, as I've already said elsewhere, in live games you can see the cards being shuffled and dealt. Furthermore, there is no collusion. Do you see the cards being shuffled online? Do you see how they are dealt? Can you guarantee there is no collusion? I think you will find that the answer to all these questions is NO. Once again... :moon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guesswest Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? Like i've already asked in another post' date=' someone tell me where there is a poker pro playing (not just promoting) online and i'll go to that site; I've yet to see one.[/quote'] Val already named a few, and as I'm sure he's aware, he barely dented the list. The fact is, more sites than not have pros playing on them. In addition to which most pros will tell you they play on various sites incognito also. Full Tilt is the most obviously pro-heavy site - I watched Phil Ivey lose 300k playing Omaha H/L on there the other night. If you go and play/watch the big buy-in tourneys on Party, Stars etc like the mil guaranteed, 750k etc - there are a lot of big name pros at those tables week in and week out. Basically, virtually all top level pros regularly play online, some with a name tag, some without, and they're spread out over every reputable site. And even then that's excluding all the thousands of guys who are playing full time and are technically 'pros', but are playing piddling stakes by comparison. You can't throw a stone and miss players like that, on every site every hour of every day. Edit: Typed 'loose' instead of 'lose' - hate that :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danno375 Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? But surely if there are big named players on a site it would be financial suicide for the site to allow them to lose? They would go and play elsewhere wouldn't they? So to maintain a valid punter/ pro ratio they must keep the pro happy. That makes sense doesn't it?? And explains some of the more obvious fixing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guesswest Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? But surely if there are big named players on a site it would be financial suicide for the site to allow them to lose? They would go and play elsewhere wouldn't they? So to maintain a valid punter/ pro ratio they must keep the pro happy. That makes sense doesn't it?? And explains some of the more obvious fixing. Hence me mentioning the fact that I just watched Ivey drop $300,000 a few days getting suckout after suckout. It's just a myth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danno375 Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? i know but they have to provide phil ivey with the 300k to lose or else people will be suspicious that the greats never lose. don't kid yourself into thinking that it was HIS 300k! it is just a sweetner to make other punters fire more cash in! Some things are only obvious when they are pointed to you. Like " how come there is no post office in Albert Square?" I would have thought it was a prime location! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePro19 Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? The pro's aren't playing with their money anyway, the site pays them to play... so, they have nothing (of theirs) to lose. By the way, FT - where did you get that handbag??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danno375 Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? the float goes under, you strike, and your tea is on the end of the line! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guesswest Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? Look. The deals are all a matter of public record. You can put together a piece of software that a decent programmer could string together in a half hour, and analyse a hand history. If you have a statistically significant sample (prob over 100,000 hands) you can prove fixing if it's present. That's all you need! There seems to be some kind of misnomer whereby there's this belief that because the code isn't open source that we don't know what it produces, we do, the cards are dealt. We can (very easily) test for fixing - it isn't there. And anyway, if you spend a period of time watching the big names play on FT etc - you'll see that they have period of great cards, periods of horrible suckouts just like everyone else. You'll also see that they play way better poker than us - that's why they're winning. And whether or not the money is in their account as a result of their sponsor paying them or as a result of their deposits, it's still theirs, and you can bet they don't view it any differently to the rest of their bankroll or feel any better about losing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valiant23 Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? Why do I keep playing when I think games are fixed??? Because I can't stop! I enjoy playing poker. Playing live games means not getting to bed before 5am if I do well, and as I have to work during the day this is not an option. Whenever I can I find something else to do, but unfortunately, when I get back home I can't resist going back online. Found something to take my mind off it for a while... Manic Miner. Played that donkeys years ago on the Commodore 64. Now got it on the PC. Brings back memories. Of the 150 or so posts I've put in, about 10-20 only are about cheating and fixing. I believe it is, and until someone shows me the code my mind will not be changed. And anyway, I'm not the one who started the thread, I just added to it... yes, the same 'tiresome posts' as my others... but then you don't have to read it. :moon Oh, and finally, as I've already said elsewhere, in live games you can see the cards being shuffled and dealt. Furthermore, there is no collusion. Do you see the cards being shuffled online? Do you see how they are dealt? Can you guarantee there is no collusion? I think you will find that the answer to all these questions is NO. Once again... :moon The Pro - First of all I DO have to read it. Secondly if I had discovered poker nearly 4 years ago when my wife was first taken ill then the last few years would have been a lot easier to cope with. I've already told a PLer how lucky they are to be in the 9-5 routine, and I mean it. As regarding live games. I've been told about a £5 rebuy tourney at Dudley (I think). Apparently people were going all in with all sorts of crap, and then sticking their hand in the air shouting "Rebuy". If you could survive the first hour that was when the 'proper' poker began. Also, if I walked into your local casino (I know its not that local, cos I remember ;)) and saw you on first name terms with the dealer wouldn't I have some suspicions, especially if I kept getting worse hands than you? And as regards collusion can you tell me its not possible for friends to try and work things to their advantage? I'm not asking you to answer those questions to be honest, I'm just trying to point out that its possible to level the same accusations. Incidentally, out of my 2000 odd posts, I don't think I've ever said online poker was fixed, but there you go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robilaruk Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? now this I do agree on - collusion between players is something that is hard to track. but i do not expect any collusion between the site and individuals and collusion does happen at a live game - just try the Walsall Grosvenor when getting close to or on the final table - the locals all seem to fold for each other or chip dump, or only play against the tourists..... never again will i play there - it was so feckin obvious yet the management do nothing about it :@ Damo Oh, and finally, as I've already said elsewhere, in live games you can see the cards being shuffled and dealt. Furthermore, there is no collusion. Do you see the cards being shuffled online? Do you see how they are dealt? Can you guarantee there is no collusion? I think you will find that the answer to all these questions is NO. Once again... :moon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valiant23 Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? the float goes under' date=' you strike, and your tea is on the end of the line![/quote'] :D :D :D Danno the naughty. :spank :lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpe1ne Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? Just one thing that always makes me laugh at this suggestion that poker is fixed.Watch any of the Late Night Poker heats on channel5 on Wednesday and you will see Aces coming up against Kings,Weird hands will appear on the flops and turns and more often than not even there River cards saves or kills most people.It re affirms any cards can come out at any time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAULM03 Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? One thing in this article really hit home to me. Quads losing to quads is over a 5million to 1 shot, you'll never see in a lifetime of live poker. It happens almost every day on their site as they deal over 4million hands a day. It's not fixed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodger Posted February 7, 2006 Author Share Posted February 7, 2006 Re: Revealed...Is online poker fixed? I reckon that that the fact that so many more hands are dealt online is probably the most important factor...makes it so much more likely that you will see a bad beat. Plus those who play four or five tables at once must be seeing them every few minutes. I strongly believe there is no fixing involved at all. The other week however, I was playing a single table with only four players left and I held over half the chips. My bad beats just followed each other like a machine gun... AA beaten by 45 making a straight:@ KK beaten by QQ making trips :@:@ Flush beaten by a house on the river:@ :@ :@ Within five minutes I was out, dragged through the thorny bushes and left bloodied by the flow of what appeared to be a thoroughly fixed game... so I've now told my kids that next time we play a game of poker they can deal the bloody cards themselves.:lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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