Trainer Quotes.. pros and cons?

[mileni4uk]

I wonder what people think about trainer's comments on their horses. The more experience I have, the better I think it is not to listen to them at all. They get stuff so wrong sometimes. For example 2 cases today. Titan De Sarti reported to have improved best of all at Nicky Henderson's. I wouldn't have backed, but trainer's optimism made me do it. As usual he was fresh and keen and didn't last in front too long. Chance Du Roy I've backed last year. Didn't back today, cos reportedly trainer thinks he needs soft ground. Well he didn't need it, he was good enough to win on good. And not just today, but in general, the more I ignore trainers the better it is for me. Just go by form, don't listen to what trainers think about their horses. What are your thoughts?

[mileni4uk]

Re: Trainer Quotes.. pros and cons? Also another example is Pipe on Great Endeavour. Last week: "don't think he stays". This week: "I think he will stay the trip if ridden differently".

[Trotter]

Re: Trainer Quotes.. pros and cons? It's difficult not to be influenced by trainer comments - after all, they see the horse every day ! But I'd much prefer to base my opinion on the form rather than on what anyone says, even the trainer, jockey, owner etc As it happens, I very rarely see these Trainer Quotes as I don't read the Stable Tours and don't have access to the RP members feature (I'm not a member !)............perhaps that's just as well as it means I can't be influenced by them

[mileni4uk]

Re: Trainer Quotes.. pros and cons? The yellow quotes on RP are part of the tipping subscription. I stopped it long time ago not to be influenced by what they say, because you can't help but look into that shiny yellow thing in there :D Hobbs' and Henderson's quotes about the two mentioned horses are in Mark Howard's book One Jump Ahead. I think it's better to just ignore and go by your own instincts. The only valuable quote would be which race is target for what horse etc. Other than that, I don't see any edge in listening to and reading about trainer/jockey views.

[Trotter]

Re: Trainer Quotes.. pros and cons? I suppose that introduces another level of uncertainty as Mark Howards book was probably written a few months ago or at least based on interviews with trainers over the summer If Henderson had been saying this morning that his horse had improved massively it would be a bit more relevant to todays race as presumably he would have included any caveats about needing the run today or ground concerns etc.

[fintron]

Re: Trainer Quotes.. pros and cons?

I wonder what people think about trainer's comments on their horses. The more experience I have, the better I think it is not to listen to them at all. They get stuff so wrong sometimes. For example 2 cases today. Titan De Sarti reported to have improved best of all at Nicky Henderson's. I wouldn't have backed, but trainer's optimism made me do it. As usual he was fresh and keen and didn't last in front too long. Chance Du Roy I've backed last year. Didn't back today, cos reportedly trainer thinks he needs soft ground. Well he didn't need it, he was good enough to win on good. And not just today, but in general, the more I ignore trainers the better it is for me. Just go by form, don't listen to what trainers think about their horses. What are your thoughts?

I agree with your last bit, stick to your own opinions because at the end of the day some of these trainers don't have a clue what the best conditions are for their horses. The way I always think about it is that it isnt punters that pay the stable bills, it is the owners, so a trainers loyalty should always be to the owners first and foremost. They can lead the punters barking up the wrong tree. Sometimes it is worth listening to them to hear the trainers plans, but Binocular winning the Champion Hurdle a few years ago shows they can renege on their word. Look at Paul Nolan too mate, not once but twice with Noble Prince and Joncol he's misled punters into thinking he'd be saddling a runner only until pulling them out at the final decs.

[TheRat]

Re: Trainer Quotes.. pros and cons? It's difficult to read them and not take on baord their opinions. I was put off Rock On Ruby today as Nicholls said he would need the run, but at the end of the day I don't believe he was putting anyone off, he is class and will probably come on still like he said. I find the jockeys better to be honest. Paul H and Barry G on our site are always very honest about their rides and are often spot on. Geraghty put me off a few today, he wasn't negative but wasn't bullish about a few either. Barry certainly put me off backing Tartan today.

[Cowan]

Re: Trainer Quotes.. pros and cons? Agree with accuracy of quotes. The RP have the quotes in each horses record and they often get a jockey/trainer/owner interview after the horse wins. Often something will be said like "We've always thought he was a good sort and he just needed x,y,z to get a win" when anyone who actually looks into the race sees that had nothing to do with it. These comments are almost always nonsense. Similarly comments from the trainer or head groom like "I've liked the look of Some Horse and think he can win a few this season" are equally worthless. He's got to say that, otherwise hes selling the horse. Quotes from Owners are almost always rubbish as they are clueless fanboys. Trainers understandably keep their cards close to their chests. Jockeys quotes are perhaps worth more when they talk about a ride but they are few and far between. Some comments I look out for are; (1) Changes in race-tactics/tack eg a change from prominent to held-up "we feel he'd be better if tried from the front" so that I know what to expect. (2) Injuries/Fitness such as "needs a few runs at the start of the season" or "had a wind operation last month" helps me eliminate some runners. [see Muftarres] (3) Handicap Mark like "the handicapper has been harsh on this one" [see Summerinthecity] (4) Description of how horse travelled in a race to give an idea of something to come or a run to ignore such as "ran at the front but got caught so Jockey eased him" [see Frequency and Tegan] On a related note, does anyone know where I can find out about horse injuries? I don't suppose they have to declare them? It seems the only way to find out is if connections let it slip out when a journalist is nearby.

[BKI Punter]

Re: Trainer Quotes.. pros and cons? I've tried staying away from them as they sway me aswell, and if I'd seen that Paul thought ROR would need the run I would've left him. I doubted the trip as it was. I saw what Henderson said about Tartan on my phone on the RP app, and it kinda swayed me even though I liked the price but as soon as he set off for the lead I thought he's being saved for another day. Henderson's that need the run often take it up early and tire. Like I said though, try avoiding them. Nothing worse than being put off because of ground/needing it/trip only for it to suit.

[Bathtime For Rupert]

Re: Trainer Quotes.. pros and cons? Don't add much for me. Especially regarding confidence. Brian Meehan will tell you all of his horses have a good chance. Paul Nicholls is often very bullish and then his horses flop. They're biased so they're going to be confident. I'm a bit more inclined to believe them if they're talking about a trip, or ground, but still it has very little impact on my bets.

[cpo]

Re: Trainer Quotes.. pros and cons? The only time I can recall that I have followed a trainers quote successfully was Brian Ellison this year in the Ebor. I don't really like them as I am easily swayed!

[Blair Boy]

Re: Trainer Quotes.. pros and cons? I often wonder how honest trainers from the larger yards are when coming to a conclusion about how a horse will perform taking into account landing a gamble on a high profile horse is out the question. Are they really just bad judges?

[Trotter]

Re: Trainer Quotes.. pros and cons? I suppose part of the problem is the same as with 'inside info' from a yard The trainer or stable lad might know that his horse is in top shape and likely to be suited by todays conditions but they've got no idea about the other horses in the race Some of them might be in even better shape and even more suited to todays conditions

[Darran]

Re: Trainer Quotes.. pros and cons? Some trainers are worth listening to and others arent. Sometimes horses can still win even if conditions arent in their favour and I dont think its the trainers putting people off they are just giving their view. Its up to you to then decide what you do with that info. I find it interesting to hear/read what they say to be honest.

[ONEDUNME]

Re: Trainer Quotes.. pros and cons?

Some trainers are worth listening to and others arent.

Spot on. Some trainers are naturally cautious and you can't blame them, whereas people like that prize cockOliver Brady idiot will tell you that his horse is going to win the Gold Cup, even though it's more likely to end up being poured out of tins of dog food.

[mowgli77]

Re: Trainer Quotes.. pros and cons? Some of the quotes are absolutely pointless, my real pet hate is the "we are hopeful of a good run" quote. Doesn't tell you anything at all, not worth the paper it's printed on. You have to know what to expect with the quotes, you won't find a trainer saying "It's an absolute dog and has no chance until it drops to sellers and claimers" as they would offend the owners. Best information you can gleam is regarding ground and trips but you can't take it as a given, use it to help you shortlist selections along with form study. Some of the flat trainers are quite honest when they tell you the horse will need the run and reading between the lines are trying to let you know not to waste your hard earned on it when it still needs a lot of work to get fully race fit.

[LoveNorthernRacing]

Re: Trainer Quotes.. pros and cons? It amazes me (I work in a betting office) how many people on a Saturday morning for example will come in and throw down some fairly decent sized bets on horses they heard mentioned by so and so trainer on The Morning Line. Of course its nice to pay out the punters when they come in, but in most cases they have been talking about their horse in the big race of the day and you might aswell close your eyes and point at the paper to pick a horse in those races!