moFace Posted July 2, 2008 Share Posted July 2, 2008 anyone tried these yet on boss? 5euro entry and top 5 get paid 10 euro out of 10 seats, good /bad idea:unsure seems like a good way to start getting a bankroll up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazdiamonds Posted July 2, 2008 Share Posted July 2, 2008 Re: cooler stt they do them on ladbrokes too i think your better off doing top 3 paid from 10 or 2 table sngs with top 4 or 5 paid id rather play too try and win the tourny. but dont let me put you off them gl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moFace Posted July 2, 2008 Author Share Posted July 2, 2008 Re: cooler stt hmm well ive played 3 5 euro ones and 2 10 euro ones and cashed each time so think im gonna keep going :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slapdash Posted July 2, 2008 Share Posted July 2, 2008 Re: cooler stt Level 4 Rounders on Prima has a very similar structure (5/10 qualify for Level 5, though the blind structure's a lot slower than this). I used to play them quite a lot, and won more than I lost. The reasons I don't play them so much now are that they get a bit boring after a while TBH, and the pool of players at that level got very small, which meant that you had to wait ages for a table to fill, and also I think you have a big advantage in this structure if the other players don't know you (in the later stages you ideally want to call bets very rarely, but you want the other players to be afraid you will call, so that they don't make the bets in the first place), and I found I was playing the same group of players all the time. I just tried a €20 and a €30 "cooler". I did something very stupid in the €20 one and was first out, but comfortably made the top 5 in the €30 one. There were several players who really didn't seem to have a clue how to adjust to this structure (though I'm sure the other players in the €20 one must have thought the same about me!), so I think this could be quite profitable until people start to get the hang of it. It's not the most enthralling form of poker, though! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazdiamonds Posted July 3, 2008 Share Posted July 3, 2008 Re: cooler stt hmm well ive played 3 5 euro ones and 2 10 euro ones and cashed each time so think im gonna keep going :) well done:) i think i'll give them a go then i will let you know how i get on later.[when ive done 5] gl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slapdash Posted July 3, 2008 Share Posted July 3, 2008 Re: cooler stt By the way, although Boss advertize this as "PERFECT if you are on tilt and want to cool down by playing tight!" this is NOT a good game for people who are prone to tilt. A large proportion of the time you lose it will be because somebody makes a lunatic call of your all-in and beats you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happyhornet Posted July 4, 2008 Share Posted July 4, 2008 Re: cooler stt I have played a couple of these on Ladbrokes and cashed both times.:) I was thinking how the strategy needs to change for this style of STT. I played TAG to start with, opened up a little, but felt unsure how to play the bubble. Perhaps a way to play it is to be LAG early, try to double up, and then sit back and drift into the money. Anyone any ideas? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slapdash Posted July 4, 2008 Share Posted July 4, 2008 Re: cooler stt I think the main difference with these is that the effect of the "Gap principle" is far greater: you should be calling very rarely and trying to win chips by making a raise that nobody calls. In my opinion: You should start off by playing very tight except with the very best hands. When it gets to 50/100 you should occasionally try to steal blinds to keep your stack at a respectable size, but you shouldn't be trying to get a big stack, you should just be trying to keep in touch. You want people to respect your raises, so you don't want to raise too often. Don't panic! If it's down to 6 players and everybody else has twice as many chips as you, then you're still a big favourite to get to the last five. But what you don't want is for your stack to get so small that it doesn't hurt the other players to call an all-in and lose. Be very reluctant to call for all your chips in the later stages. Don't call just because you think you're favourite against his range: typically you want to be close to a 2/1 favourite. Try to make the other players think that there's a danger that you will call. Occasionally "think" for a while before you fold, but don't overdo it or it will get too obvious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slapdash Posted July 24, 2008 Share Posted July 24, 2008 Re: cooler stt I see they now have these up to a €50+€5 buy-in ... for "high-rollers" who enjoy the world's most boring form of poker! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slapdash Posted July 24, 2008 Share Posted July 24, 2008 Re: cooler stt I played a few of the €50 ones this evening (won 4, lost 2). I've mostly been playing €20 and €30, and the standard at €50 seems worse, if anything: more people trying to be heroes, which is not the way to play this. Here's one of the ones I lost. I hesitated about posting this, because it looks as though I'm moaning about a bad beat. But honestly I'm not looking for sympathy ... so please don't give it! ... I'm just trying to illustrate how badly people understand how to play this, even at the "top" level. (OK, I admit that my first thought was "You bastard!", but my second thought was "Do you come here often?" :D). Taking the payout structure into account, I think this ranks as one of the worst plays I've ever seen at a poker table. ***** Hand 1172515562 ***** 50.00/100.00 Texas Hold'em (No Limit) - 24 July 2008 21:48:14 Cooler (Real/Tournament) Seat 1: ClubPoker (1290.00) Seat 2: slapdash1 (1310.00) Seat 3: Bazzzzza (1110.00) Seat 4: I Normal U (1580.00) Seat 5: millenlp (1140.00) Seat 6: alebo (1605.00) Seat 7: liowig (2291.00) Seat 8: HesteHeino (2560.00) Seat 9: andry94 (1214.00) Seat 10: Para-81 (900.00) slapdash1 post SB 50.00 Bazzzzza post BB 100.00 ** Deal ** ClubPoker [N/A, N/A] slapdash1 [Ac, As] Bazzzzza [N/A, N/A] I Normal U [N/A, N/A] millenlp [N/A, N/A] alebo [N/A, N/A] liowig [N/A, N/A] HesteHeino [N/A, N/A] andry94 [N/A, N/A] Para-81 [N/A, N/A] *** Bet Round 1 *** I Normal U Fold millenlp Fold alebo Fold liowig Fold HesteHeino Raise to 300.00 andry94 Fold Para-81 Fold ClubPoker Fold slapdash1 All-in 1310.00 Bazzzzza Fold HesteHeino Call 1310.00 *** Flop(Board): *** : [4d, 7c, Ad] *** Turn(Board): *** : [4d, 7c, Ad, 6d] *** River(Board): *** : [4d, 7c, Ad, 6d, Qs] *** Showdown *** : Rake: 0.00 Total Pot: 2720.00 ClubPoker Fold Win: 0.00 slapdash1 [Ac, As] Three of a kind, aces Win: 0.00 Bazzzzza Fold Win: 0.00 I Normal U Fold Win: 0.00 millenlp Fold Win: 0.00 alebo Fold Win: 0.00 liowig Fold Win: 0.00 HesteHeino [9d, 10d] Ace high flush Win: 2720.00 andry94 Fold Win: 0.00 Para-81 Fold Win: 0.00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slapdash Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 Re: cooler stt I see they now have these up to a €50+€5 buy-in ... for "high-rollers" who enjoy the world's most boring form of poker! And now they have them at €100+€9, though these tables seem to take forever to fill most of the time. I've just started playing one after about 90 minutes wait. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samba_SamPa Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 Re: cooler stt And now they have them at €100+€9' date=' though these tables seem to take [b']forever to fill most of the time. I've just started playing one after about 90 minutes wait. 45 minutes for a €91 return is nice. To what extent are these decided by poker ability, and how much is it there's 7 or 8 left when the blinds reach such a level is a shove/fold lottery? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slapdash Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 Re: cooler stt 45 minutes for a €91 return is nice. To what extent are these decided by poker ability, and how much is it there's 7 or 8 left when the blinds reach such a level is a shove/fold lottery? It depends what you mean by "poker ability", really. :lol There's certainly skill involved (or at least I like to think so, as I've been doing quite well in them :D), but it's very different from the skill you need in a normal STT. Post-flop play is pretty much irrelevant, at least if you play them the way I think you should. It usually does come down to shove/fold with 7 or 8 left, but the payout structure makes a huge difference to how you should play at this stage compared to a normal STT, and there are a lot of players who really don't seem to know how they should be adjusting (at least in my opinion). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 Re: cooler stt Doesn't the 10% rake on these make them stupidly -Ev over the long term? You need a 55% cash rate to break even, that's a massive edge. Is it doable? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slapdash Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 Re: cooler stt Doesn't the 10% rake on these make them stupidly -Ev over the long term? You need a 55% cash rate to break even, that's a massive edge. Is it doable? Just been checking my stats. I'm shocked to find I've played 91 of them :loon at stakes ranging from €5 to €100 (about half of those at €50). €5: won 1 - lost 0 €10: 3-0 €20: 8-6 €30: 14-9 €50: 26-17 €100: 6-1 That's a profit of €796.50 and ROI of +18.81% after rake (though I'm sure I've been lucky to have done so well at the €100 level), and in total I've won 58 and lost 33 (a win rate of 63.74%). Over the long term, I'm sure people will learn how to play them, and the golden goose will die, but at the moment there are enough people who don't have a clue that I'm pretty sure I can make a decent profit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slapdash Posted August 21, 2008 Share Posted August 21, 2008 Re: cooler stt They have these at €200, €300 and €500 now, though I've not seen anybody playing them, or even sitting at the tables, yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valiant23 Posted August 22, 2008 Share Posted August 22, 2008 Re: cooler stt I've played quite a few of these at the lower levels and I've cashed in the vast majority of them by keeping out of trouble, playing big hands and position hard and using strong aces for fold equity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slapdash Posted August 22, 2008 Share Posted August 22, 2008 Re: cooler stt I've played quite a few of these at the lower levels and I've cashed in the vast majority of them by keeping out of trouble' date=' playing big hands and position hard and using strong aces for fold equity.[/quote'] Strangely, my impression is that it's not that much harder to cash at the higher levels than at the lower. My success rate at various levels bears this out, though I haven't really played enough games at any one level for it to be statistically significant. At all levels, I don't think a lot of players realize quite how much they should be adapting their game for the structure. The mistakes are different at different levels: at the lower levels, as always, players tend to overvalue their hands, but at higher levels players try too hard to be clever and outplay their opponents post-flop, which I think is a very bad strategy with this structure. And some of the lower level "bad plays", such as making absurdly large raises, are just not so bad in this game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slapdash Posted September 7, 2008 Share Posted September 7, 2008 Re: cooler stt I've just played my 200th of these, and my won-lost stats at various levels are: €3 1-1 €5 6-3 €10 3-0 €20 8-6 €30 14-9 €50 77-44 €100 20-8 total 129-71 I've mostly played at €50 and €100 recently, and although I haven't played enough (especially at €100) for the stats to be significant, I do feel the €50 ones are tougher than the €100 ones! The only reason I haven't played more at €100 is that those tables are a lot slower to fill up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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