Hugh Taylor

[casey jones]

Can anyone explain to me what this guy is up to! He can quite clearly can tip winners which are value if you can get on! He tips Horses up anytime after 9.50 when very few firms are up, hence destroying markets! He giving away Tips for free (very Commendable) but what’s he alternative motive. Theirs no such thing as a free lunch!

Most emails relating to this guy are from people trying to back his selection but they cant get on at the recommend price. Does this Guy have an agreement with certain leading bookmakers who accommodate him and slash the price knowing they can lay it at half the odds? As he doesn’t charge something doesn’t add up, he must be backing them and laying them back and making fortunes daily irrespective of the final result. Great for him but this means he’s laying people he’s tipping not very ethical, but the game is full of ------------. I cant work out if this guy is genuine why he isn’t charging for a his service, other high profile TV tipsters are raking it in with Phone lines services, yet our boy HUGH is free. He is stupid or is something funny going on here, something just doesn’t add up!

Yes he’s showing a profit but what he’s actually claiming is nonsense because very few can get on at the best odds so you can knock off 33% of what s he’s actually claiming in winning tips. I can’t find any other site returning huge profits that don’t require a fee, most tipping services send out selections from midday onwards this bloke is sending them first thing and smashing markets to bits. This is excellent if you fancy something else in the race but a pain in the arse if he drops on one you fancy.

It won’t be long owners and trainers get the raving needle with this bloke tipping up horse having ridiculous stakes on at big prices and crashing markets. While some services give a fair service and provide long term profits most of them allow owners to get there bet on first before sending it out to there clients. I do know a few owners who have been very annoyed about not getting a price about own Horses; I can confirm none of them won. From a punters point of view he’s also a nuisance I wanted to back POPPY & PENNY at Windsor the other day, two horses were withdrawn which caused a reformed market ,but at just after 10 o’clock he sent a 3 point win@9/2 before the market had chance to settle down. Within a matter of minutes it was 7/2 form an early price of 5/1 while I don’t bet huge I would have liked a reasonable bet e/w at 5/1 due to this bloke I sat and watched it canter home.

While you cant please everybody all of the time and some will be delighted with his free service I cant see any benefit to smashing up markets in an age were Betfair has no liquidity until 4 minutes before the off. The days of making money form Traditional bookmakers are becoming increasing difficult, without Hugh Taylor intervention. He clearly doesn’t follow any code in regards owners who keep the game alive and everybody’s got to eat. It appears HUGH is eating a bit too well right now.

Regards from Punter still fighting in shark infested waters

[billy the punter]

Re: Hugh Taylor I agree that claims should only count if the prices are readily available. I know for a fact, that if you want to claim profits in a Racing Post ad then you have to prove the price was available when your message goes out. You have to take a screen print showing the betting slip with the bookmaker along with the time. It's a pain, but fair. Btw he is not doing it for free, he is an employee of ATR.

[fintron]

Re: Hugh Taylor Yeah, Hugh can be annoying when he crashes the markets, but what you have to do is study the night before if you can and then get on about 9- 9.30 the next morning. Bet 365 and Betfred are always the first up around 9 am and then the likes of Paddypower and VC bet follow shortly after, by 9.30 you're getting a good enough spread IMO and the big four all have prices up before Hugh posts his blog. You do feel cheated if taking 6/1 for a horse that was say 14/1 in the morning before Hugh got there, I agree, so you gotta get in there quick or painfully watch it come in as you say. All of his updates are at 10 am so thats the latest you gotta act. Admittedly this may not help an owner wanting to get on on course. I like his column though, although it would be impossible for anyone to yield the exact profits he does it is a free resource and I have learned bits off him. I like his staking plan where he goes top heavy on the win, like 3 pt win, 1 pt place, sounds daft but I never thought to do that before! He likes to look for underated horses and its a good approach to follow so I am grateful for it being free. Mayy Doyle who he replaced never gave reasoning like Hugh does either, it was name and a price (I think). Also, his selections are a dream if you are a layer. if you pick out a lay the night before and he decides to tip it up you can sometimes rake in double the profits once his prices are out, so its def worth holding back with the lays some days.

[Trotter]

Re: Hugh Taylor I don't usually read his column ( I might start now though !) but I watch him on ATR on Wednesdays and Fridays. No doubt he tips lots of winners but I find that his eyecatchers all tend to be the same type - horses running on from the rear once the race is over or horses hampered in the last furlong. And I thought it was a bit of 'racing logic' that you don't make money backing horses who get hampered or horses who run on when the race is over................

[fintron]

Re: Hugh Taylor

I don't usually read his column ( I might start now though !) but I watch him on ATR on Wednesdays and Fridays. No doubt he tips lots of winners but I find that his eyecatchers all tend to be the same type - horses running on from the rear once the race is over or horses hampered in the last furlong. And I thought it was a bit of 'racing logic' that you don't make money backing horses who get hampered or horses who run on when the race is over................

My reading of his tips is that he looks for horses that have been underestimated, so often I have read "stayed on but was drawn on the unfavoured side" etc and that is important and a good pointer in large fields IMO Rather than just looking for who is the most likely winner of the race he looks for horses that are overpriced. Sometimes that means taking a punt on one that runs like a donkey, but other times he will have been grinning like the cat that got the cream. His full figures are published on his site too - you can't argue with those really.

[casey jones]

Re: Hugh Taylor You can argue with his figures because very few can get on at the recommend price so it gives a false picture. Why on earth would you want to put bets forward at 10 o clock when a few mickey mouse are up, firstly only the odd few will be accommodated so your service to the customer is pathetic and they will end up marked up as a Hugh Taylor arber and restricted to £25.

Secondly the bookmakers can then lay a 16/1 chance at 8/1 to the real money and takes any value out of the selection. Why on earth punters want to 8/1 about something that’s 16/1 is beyond me, but there are a lot of sheep around.

I am not sure what his modus operation is, from what I can see his selections are horses that have run or been unlucky and puts them forward as a tip. What he doesn’t appear good at is sensing what trip they need, BRADS LUCK was a perfect example he tipped it over the wrong trip. Much to my glee as I laid it, he appears to work on trends and stats if you read his column. These can be very misleading unless you do laborious study with a fine tooth coomb, he’s clearly doing a lot of painstaking work but for what return a wage from ATR or is laying back selections and making 10k a week out of all the silly sods who help crash his selections!

[fintron]

Re: Hugh Taylor

You can argue with his figures because very few can get on at the recommend price so it gives a false picture. Why on earth would you want to put bets forward at 10 o clock when a few mickey mouse are up, firstly only the odd few will be accommodated so your service to the customer is pathetic and they will end up marked up as a Hugh Taylor arber and restricted to £25.

Secondly the bookmakers can then lay a 16/1 chance at 8/1 to the real money and takes any value out of the selection. Why on earth punters want to 8/1 about something that’s 16/1 is beyond me, but there are a lot of sheep around.

I am not sure what his modus operation is, from what I can see his selections are horses that have run or been unlucky and puts them forward as a tip. What he doesn’t appear good at is sensing what trip they need, BRADS LUCK was a perfect example he tipped it over the wrong trip. Much to my glee as I laid it, he appears to work on trends and stats if you read his column. These can be very misleading unless you do laborious study with a fine tooth coomb, he’s clearly doing a lot of painstaking work but for what return a wage from ATR or is laying back selections and making 10k a week out of all the silly sods who help crash his selections!

I know what you are saying about not everyone being able to take the prices he quotes, but that isnt Hugh's fault really. He can't help being a value spotter and if everyone else follows blindly. The only way around this would be to declare profits to SP, but that wouldn't be fair on him really considering the influence he has 15/2 shots into 7/2 come the off etc. I was more responding to Trotters point to be honest, that backing hampered horses and horses running on once the race was over was not a profitable strategy - because I don't actually think this is what Hugh does, and whatever he does, he does it bloody good. According to the latest figure his cumulative profit to date is +385.70 having taken over the column in March. I don't what what yield that converts to but his max bet is 5 pts I think, so that is very impressive stuff. He is paid to tip winners (I wonder what sort of salary he is on at ATR? Nevison said in his book he got a £100k signing on fee and £10k a month if I remember correctly, for one tipping line he was part of with Mark Winstanley and some other bloke whose name escapes me...I wonder how Hugh's compares to that) but not many free services out there can boast figures like that.

[Trotter]

Re: Hugh Taylor Fin..........I was really talking about his 'Eyecatchers' that he puts on the Wed and Fri shows on ATR.......I don't think these are necessarily the same horses that he picks for his daily tips. - these are horses that he's noted in the last few days. The might not run again for 6 months ! In fact he often says of his 'Eyecatchers' that they probably won't be value next time out because everyone has seen them running on or being hampered.

[casey jones]

Re: Hugh Taylor ATR were losing between £90-100k per year i not sure what the figures are right now, Hugh Taylor salary wouldnt be anything speacial they have too many presenters and imposters to pay. Its true he make Matt Doyle look like a schoolboy, As for Nevison the days of him getting paid £100k a year for tipping are long gone he simply doesnt tip enough winners. Having said that i must say that Nevision is a world class salesman hes made fortunes from book sales and business interests including a few betting sites. This site gives you all results from leading tipsters over a long period, Hugh Taylor is still new to these lists so he doesnt figure that highly as of yet, but it opens your eyes to some of the higher profile tipsters! http://www.relayline.com/index.htm

[fintron]

Re: Hugh Taylor

Fin..........I was really talking about his 'Eyecatchers' that he puts on the Wed and Fri shows on ATR.......I don't think these are necessarily the same horses that he picks for his daily tips. - these are horses that he's noted in the last few days. The might not run again for 6 months ! In fact he often says of his 'Eyecatchers' that they probably won't be value next time out because everyone has seen them running on or being hampered.

my mistake :spank I'd like to watch that, but dont have any racing channels :(

[Labrador]

Re: Hugh Taylor I expect that Hugh has been a significant reason for the big improvements to the ATR website. The addition of the Timeform assessments for each horse is excellent. ATR must have gained much more traffic to the site solely down to Hugh, with consequent improvements in advertising revenue etc. ATR have also been helped by the so-called "improvements" to the Racing Post website which many found to be far less user-friendly and then by Racing Post shooting themselves in the foot by charging for so much of their information. I heard Dave Nevison say himself that the ATR site is his first port of call for form study and research. (Don't suppose his RUK buddies were too chuffed at that :)) It would be more sensible if Hugh's profit and loss figures were also given to SP, because it is virtually impossible to take his recommended/advised prices.

[billy the punter]

Re: Hugh Taylor

ATR were losing between £90-100k per year i not sure what the figures are right now, Hugh Taylor salary wouldnt be anything speacial they have too many presenters and imposters to pay. Its true he make Matt Doyle look like a schoolboy, As for Nevison the days of him getting paid £100k a year for tipping are long gone he simply doesnt tip enough winners. Having said that i must say that Nevision is a world class salesman hes made fortunes from book sales and business interests including a few betting sites. This site gives you all results from leading tipsters over a long period, Hugh Taylor is still new to these lists so he doesnt figure that highly as of yet, but it opens your eyes to some of the higher profile tipsters! http://www.relayline.com/index.htm

Be careful of relayline info. They have a service on that site called The Prophet (same as mine). Now it's probably another service with the same name as the figures they are quoting for it has nothing to do with me. If that is me then the figures are totally inaccurate. They said I had 30 bets in September - not true I had over 100, it's a daily service. I suspect it isn't me and another service of the same name, but you see how misleading this can be for customers lookin to try certain services. If it is another service of the same name then why are they monitoring a "lost" service and not mine which is advertised in the RP everyday? How helpful is that to punters?

[TheBoyRooney]

Re: Hugh Taylor he's a class tipster pure and simple..but its not his fault that the price comes in drastically..it's like saying some one like russ p has a 20-1 quoted as one of his picks,and it goes to 12-1 straight after,and wins at 5-1 or something...Do we say "good 5-1 or 12-1 winner russ"??...he has to go with the price that is available at time of posting....what can he put on his page....Profits on bets + 367,profits ten minutes after i put my bets up 105??? now in saying that i will say one thing...i was refreshing taylors page a few times and the pick came up and i was on the pp site and the price had gone already within 1 second...??:unsure

[Gingertipster]

Re: Hugh Taylor Hugh Taylors tips are entirely done on value, those who's price underestimates it's chance. Once he's worked out his 100% book he looks at the early odds and tips the one that is best value. There are usually only one or two horses in a field that a form expert believes are value. Therefore it would be foolish to wait another hour before tipping. As there's probably going to be other value punters who identify the horse and get on. Shortening the price before you can get on / tip it yourself. To think there is any ulterior motive in his tipping is crazy. Any ultra-good tipster will have his tips shorten drastically almost immediately. Not Hugh Taylor's fault. So it would be wrong to judge him on anything else but the price at the time of tip. He regularly tells you what the lowest price to take should be anyway. "Available at 20/1 (5% chance) and I rate it as a true 10/1 (9%) chance" So you only should back that tip at better than 10/1. It is unfair to judge him on SP as if it went off at 8/1 SP it would not be a tip.

[RussP]

Re: Hugh Taylor Completely agree with Ginge's post here:ok However, I will say that I prefer to read the opinions of the guys on here and follow my own heart (although it ain't doing me any favours at the minute:lol)

[fintron]

Re: Hugh Taylor I was having a re-read of Nevison's book last night and he says that in his opinion all tipping lines/services are doomed to failure in the long run anyway. The crap tipsters don't get support so die off through lack of profit, whilst the value is quashed out of those selections posted up by successful tipsters, and the market learns to accomodate them. I can see where he is coming from really, every horse has its price, so if a tipster has to declare the profits to SP then they may end up having to stick with bets by their name that would not have been bets in the tipsters mind if he had known they would have been steamed. I think this is what Ginge meant in his last post.

[Gingertipster]

Re: Hugh Taylor Exactly Fintron.:ok Billy, Can't you complain to relayline? Wrong figures will hurt your buisness. Is it possible to get copyright on "The Prophet" name?

[turfaccountantsnightmare]

Re: Hugh Taylor Hello to everyone, I have read the posts about Hugh Taylor and have found them amusing. Anyone offering free tips that are profitable can't be bad. I like to look at his tips to see which horses he selects to realise any drastic market movers in the morning especially if I have made the same selection. A lot of what has been stated in the posts is right but please remember that the points staking system that Hugh Taylor has is IMPOSSIBLE to use with ANY fixed odds bookmaker. Any punter who turns over a regular profit with ANY traditional bookmaker will either be restricted or barred. I like to think of all bookmakers as Turf Accountants as they balance their books every day and will never lay a decent bet for any selection that has a chance. I think anyone reading Hugh Taylor's tips with his 'Points' stated should use them as a pointer and not be so naive to believe that several hundred pounds could be staked with a bookmaker. I am barred from most of the smaller bookmakers and the biggest bookmakers in the UK will only let me bet £5 or £10 bets. Therefore, how can anyone put £100 or more on a horse unless they have a losing streak. Also, I can't imagine ANY bookmaker allowing Hugh Taylor to put a bet on with them knowing he has the potential to turn a profit? Remember, if anyone can place a large bet on a horse with a bookmaker then they will have an account in LOSS and not profit unless they are a new punter. Bookmakers don't exist only Turf Accountants!

[Alice]

Re: Hugh Taylor Looks like he was that good, seems hes gone now, with Enzo putting up the tips for today, No doubt a Hugh Taylor pay for info site will appear soon.

[chris34]

Re: Hugh Taylor MMM You appear to be right he has been taken down from the tips section of ATR although I think im right in saying he is a flat boy so that maybe why!

[billy the punter]

Re: Hugh Taylor

Exactly Fintron.:ok Billy, Can't you complain to relayline? Wrong figures will hurt your buisness. Is it possible to get copyright on "The Prophet" name?

I did think of emailing them. Not sure about getting a copyright, The Prophet they monitor was probably around before me so not sure how it would work. You're right though, it's not good for business. :ok

[fintron]

Re: Hugh Taylor Tony Ennis filled in for Hugh for a couple of days earlier in the season but like you two both says, his link has now been removed from the ATR page so maybe his absence this time is more permanent, which would be a real shame. Talking about paid services, has anyone else received a spam email from Short Racing - I presume set up by that Elliott Short that made the tabloids earlier in the season with claims of vast profits from laying on Betfair. I wondered how long it would be until a service was launched in view of the publicity, although I havent been able to open the email at work because of a firewall!

[RuleBritannia]

Re: Hugh Taylor I heard Matt Chapman make some sort of reference to Hugh Taylor yesterday when Reggae Rock won the 1st at Galway. Never made out what he said, but it was definitely said to or at Hugh Taylor.

[TheBoyRooney]

Re: Hugh Taylor from atr website Editor's note: We've had lots of emails regarding Hugh Taylor's current whereabouts. Don't worry, he'll be back on attheraces.com in a few days - we felt he deserved a short break after registering his eighth consecutive month of profit.:cow

[casey jones]

Re: Hugh Taylor Like i said if he keeps putting 3pt wins @ 16/1 + owners will be making there own choices. Crashing horse prices at 10 oclock in the morning is a ----- trick, we all know how hard it is to get accomadated with Bookmakers and yes all these followers of Hugh Taylor will be marked up and have probably ruined there own accounts long term. So while hes claiming losts of credit , unless hes got an agreement with several bookmakers to back horses to win £2000 or more he must be clueless! Becasue hes costing himslef fortunes, drawing a wage from ATR doesnt equate to his what he should be winning backing all his selections at the best odds recorded! If he waited until the markets were set on the exchange he would fine even more value ( if he kept them to himself ), but this appears to have passed over everyones head! Bring back Matt Doyle he was dreadful at least markets wouldnt be smashed to bits early doors!

[Stevet1859]

Re: Hugh Taylor I 've read this thead a couple of times, (maybe I'm missing something), but to my mind Hugh is only doing what he is paid to do. The fact he is doing it so well is having the effect on the markets. I take the point that he should put his tips up at 12:00 each day, apart from that I can't see what he is doing 'wrong'. I've not benefited from his selections - I can't access the site from work, but I always read his column of an evening. In my opinion, he is top class, the profit he has made since March is excellent.

[fintron]

Re: Hugh Taylor

I 've read this thead a couple of times, (maybe I'm missing something), but to my mind Hugh is only doing what he is paid to do. The fact he is doing it so well is having the effect on the markets. I take the point that he should put his tips up at 12:00 each day, apart from that I can't see what he is doing 'wrong'. I've not benefited from his selections - I can't access the site from work, but I always read his column of an evening. In my opinion, he is top class, the profit he has made since March is excellent.

I agree with you Steve, Hugh is only doing what he is paid to do and he obviously tries to be as profitable as possible, so that means taking the value whilst it is out there. If he hangs around longer than 10:00 am other judges will have snapped up the value and then he is left without a bet. Casey, I don't see how Hugh is costing himself fortunes? I understand that bookmakers will have likely shut down or restricted his accounts if he is a big hitter, but if he bets in large amounts the chances are he would have been having trouble getting on anyway, and more likely than not is an exchange punter anyway. That way he gets pretty much the best prices going, and gets on at the volume he needs. I think he just quotes bookies prices for the benefit of his readers, I personally doubt he takes those prices himself, and if he does, it is probably via betting agents?

[casey jones]

Re: Hugh Taylor NOWS ITS ALL MAKING SENSE! Hugo Taylor is now proofing to the Secret Betting Club which can only mean one thing, hes been using ATR as a flatform to launch his Tipster career! What makes alarming reading is that all his selctions actually make a loss to Betfair S/P ( after 5% commission!) It also highlights huge issues at what time selections are posted and how many people really get accomdated at the suggested price. This is occuring mainly because its free and bookmakers are slashing prices without laying any volumes of money. It would appear that Hugo is about to join the long list of tipsters who charge for the privalge. This does quite clearly make his figures quoted a complete joke because the ROI at the suggested prices isnt avaviable to the masses just a handful. So hes been crashing markets at 10 oclock for what? Hes tips at Betfair s/p run at a loss, i am sure the Secret Betting Club do a full review on sites it will be intresting to see how HUGO fares long term.

[Gingertipster]

Re: Hugh Taylor Hmmm, Casey, there have been other threads on other forum sites recently that are consistant with someone who is hell bent on destroying Hugh Taylor's reputation. Despite explaining how these things work, you still persist. Your posts indicate you have absolutely no idea. Please, read my posts and listen to others. Hugh produces a 100% tissue on a race to find the horse who is best value, to tip. If he tips a horse at 20/1 (5%) because he feels it has a 9% chance (true 10/1 shot); and it is well backed in to 8/1 betfair SP. Had it been originally 8/1 (11%), it would not have been a tip. Profit making is all about getting VALUE. So why do you think it is fair to call this tip 8/1? When it would not be his tip at 8/1? Of course his tips are not going to make a profit at betfair SP, because they are well backed, and bookies have reacted to the market. Stop trying to make PL members see things that just are not there. Your arguement is a stupid one that does you no justice Casey. ANSWER THE QUESTION!:@ Mark

[casey jones]

Re: Hugh Taylor He has tipped one today FOREST DANE @ 25/1 Stan James! How many people have got on at 25/1? Probably 3 or 4 to £25 Bookmakers will have cut it to 12/1 and laid it so they have probably averaged around 14/1. How can you proof at 25/1 when very few can get accomdated it utter b------!