Time to give up after almost 20 years of gambling?

[richdeniro]

Bit of a long post and not meant as in a woe is me kind of way, just started typing and wanted to put it down on paper. Am sure there are a million posts like this all over the internet but maybe it will be cathartic.

I have been gambling/trading on Betfair since 2005 and recently requested a deposit v withdrawal statement which showed that I have lost a little over £40,000 since then. It has put into perspective just how hard it is to make any extra money on the side and am, not for the first time, thinking it really is time to call it a day.

I guess a £2-3k loss every year isn't a huge amount in the grand scheme of things and was probably just about the amount I could afford to lose but added up it equates to well over a years salary which makes it all the more depressing especially as I fell hook line and sinker in hoping that gambling might be the golden ticket to making a little bit extra cash that might give me a slightly better quality of life.

I guess that's the reason most of us get into gambling really, the hope of being the 0.1% that actually do make money. For me I have always been fairly unremarkable I guess, live and work in London in a fairly average job always in the 25-35k mark and with no real creative talent or the extroversion or confidence to make much of a career - personality type is INFJ so I am very aware of my flaws and also fairly cynical of the working world having spent almost a year unemployed due to the financial crash and worked for pretty bad employers. I guess gambling/trading gave me the same hope that the lottery has but that it felt more realistic a dream to stumble across some sort of system that might get me out of my one bedroom flat and into being able to own my own home and not have that permanent worry about money. My brother also has severe mental health issues and was effectively made homeless by the coalition government when the austerity cuts hit for a few weeks in 2016 which made me double down on my efforts as I never wanted my family to go through that again so sought to try and make money to deal with that.

But after 20 years and now in my mid-40s, I've read almost everything there is to read about systems, I've paid tipsters, invested in automated betting software, trying spread betting on IG and countless other things I haven't even come close to making the money I lost back in order to break even.

Is it completely hopeless? Has anyone ever made it work or successfully made back a massive chunk they have lost over the years? Or even just stumbled across a system that works for them after many years? At the moment I've resorted to putting anywhere between £2 and £10 on ridiculous 20 leg accumulators in an attempt to win my money back which seems ridiculous and is just increasing that losses figure.

Can anyone recommend any other way to make a decent amount of cash every month? I'm not a shirker and always happy to put the graft in but everything just seems impossible - I've tried dropshipping, buying and selling at auctions, share trading, doing things on fivver, etc but after almost two decades of trying am now thinking I should just accept that this is my lot.

[LEE-GRAYS]

Don’t give up follow the daily lucky 15 thread on the at the races  you can’t go wrong ⚒👍

[Zilzalian]

3 hours ago, richdeniro said:

Bit of a long post and not meant as in a woe is me kind of way, just started typing and wanted to put it down on paper. Am sure there are a million posts like this all over the internet but maybe it will be cathartic.

I have been gambling/trading on Betfair since 2005 and recently requested a deposit v withdrawal statement which showed that I have lost a little over £40,000 since then. It has put into perspective just how hard it is to make any extra money on the side and am, not for the first time, thinking it really is time to call it a day.

I guess a £2-3k loss every year isn't a huge amount in the grand scheme of things and was probably just about the amount I could afford to lose but added up it equates to well over a years salary which makes it all the more depressing especially as I fell hook line and sinker in hoping that gambling might be the golden ticket to making a little bit extra cash that might give me a slightly better quality of life.

I guess that's the reason most of us get into gambling really, the hope of being the 0.1% that actually do make money. For me I have always been fairly unremarkable I guess, live and work in London in a fairly average job always in the 25-35k mark and with no real creative talent or the extroversion or confidence to make much of a career - personality type is INFJ so I am very aware of my flaws and also fairly cynical of the working world having spent almost a year unemployed due to the financial crash and worked for pretty bad employers. I guess gambling/trading gave me the same hope that the lottery has but that it felt more realistic a dream to stumble across some sort of system that might get me out of my one bedroom flat and into being able to own my own home and not have that permanent worry about money. My brother also has severe mental health issues and was effectively made homeless by the coalition government when the austerity cuts hit for a few weeks in 2016 which made me double down on my efforts as I never wanted my family to go through that again so sought to try and make money to deal with that.

But after 20 years and now in my mid-40s, I've read almost everything there is to read about systems, I've paid tipsters, invested in automated betting software, trying spread betting on IG and countless other things I haven't even come close to making the money I lost back in order to break even.

Is it completely hopeless? Has anyone ever made it work or successfully made back a massive chunk they have lost over the years? Or even just stumbled across a system that works for them after many years? At the moment I've resorted to putting anywhere between £2 and £10 on ridiculous 20 leg accumulators in an attempt to win my money back which seems ridiculous and is just increasing that losses figure.

Can anyone recommend any other way to make a decent amount of cash every month? I'm not a shirker and always happy to put the graft in but everything just seems impossible - I've tried dropshipping, buying and selling at auctions, share trading, doing things on fivver, etc but after almost two decades of trying am now thinking I should just accept that this is my lot.

First thing is to Stop trying to win your money back, second thing is stop paying others for ideas, 3rd thing is drop your stakes right down, Like @LEE-GRAYS said read the whole of the lucky 15 thread take note of the ideas that suit you your monetary situation, with all due respect that is probably your level. 4th keep your betting separate from your social situation it will never solve it. Lastly stop gambling and start to have a bet well within your means you will find it far more enjoyable and occasionally profitable. Get rid of the " i'm a loser" attitude, expect to lose what money you bet then you can only ever be pleasantly surprised. Start afresh.

[Maxi Stavros]

Really good post Rich, I can relate to what you say so much. I’m in my mid 40s and I too have spent years trying to crack the code with the aim of making a living from sports betting/trading. For me I just find work a waste of our lifetime, all these precious days written off as we are at work from early morning to evening. I hate having a lack of job security and hate being an employee. If I could make a living from gambling it would be a dream. 
I too have paid for products such as Caan Berry’s pre race trading although I thought his material was pretty poor, didn’t really explain what he was looking for. Ive followed tipsters to see how they do but to be honest all the tipsters I have followed at best just break even. I’ve recorded thousands of bets on spreadsheets to try find out what type of bet works best and trying to find an edge. That’s been my most interesting finds. 
I’ve not lost the sort of money you mention, I believe I’m down about £5k over the last 10 years. I’m not bothered by that, I do love gambling and it does give me hope. But yeah I understand how you feel, you are at a crossroads not knowing which way to go with betting, seems like you have resigned yourself to the fact there is no answer to cracking the code. 
It is a question I often ask myself - is sports betting beatable? We all know that casino games like roulette is not beatable, no system can beat the fact that the odds with that zero on the board is always in the casinos favour. The same can be said for football, if the bookies price markets correctly and have a margin then how can it be beatable? Do I think it’s beatable? I think there must be a way otherwise why would betting companies restrict some people’s accounts and why do Betfair issue a premium charge for people up over £250k. But what is it that these people are doing I do not know. But I keep trying to crack the code hoping I will join those people. 

[MCLARKE]

The stark reality is that the vast majority of punters lose money. Probably only the top 1% make a reasonable profit.

Personally I lost money for 30 years and only in the last 10 years have I made a profit. I might breakeven by the time I die !

Do not be so downbeat about work, we should all have to put something into life if we want to get something out of it. 

View betting as entertainment, if you make some profit take that as a bonus.

Ignore tipsters, there are some good ones but they are victims of their own success, it is difficult to get on at the advertised prices

Take advantage of as many offers the bookmakers offer but be careful when using them and read the small print. For free bets back at odds between 13/2 and 10/1.

Good current offers include BET365 superboosts and 25% winnings boost, SKY money back as cash offers (back the favourite), extra place races and football price boosts. Always use BOG. There are lots more with other bookmakers but I am restricted with most of them so I'm not sure of the exact details. I've made about £10k over the last few years from these offers. 

Apart from offers, use Betfair Starting Prices to place horse racing bets. Make sure you are on the 2% commission rate. In simple terms the top 49% make profits, the bottom 51% make losses, no guarantee of making a profit but a much better starting point than with standard bookmakers.

Keep your expectations low. Keep meticulous records and expect your bank to grow slowly over time.

 

 

 

 

[Skittle]

The 20 leg accumulators are a goldmine.................for the bookmakers.

[leroxog]

On 4/20/2023 at 5:52 PM, richdeniro said:

Bit of a long post and not meant as in a woe is me kind of way, just started typing and wanted to put it down on paper. Am sure there are a million posts like this all over the internet but maybe it will be cathartic.

I have been gambling/trading on Betfair since 2005 and recently requested a deposit v withdrawal statement which showed that I have lost a little over £40,000 since then. It has put into perspective just how hard it is to make any extra money on the side and am, not for the first time, thinking it really is time to call it a day.

I guess a £2-3k loss every year isn't a huge amount in the grand scheme of things and was probably just about the amount I could afford to lose but added up it equates to well over a years salary which makes it all the more depressing especially as I fell hook line and sinker in hoping that gambling might be the golden ticket to making a little bit extra cash that might give me a slightly better quality of life.

I guess that's the reason most of us get into gambling really, the hope of being the 0.1% that actually do make money. For me I have always been fairly unremarkable I guess, live and work in London in a fairly average job always in the 25-35k mark and with no real creative talent or the extroversion or confidence to make much of a career - personality type is INFJ so I am very aware of my flaws and also fairly cynical of the working world having spent almost a year unemployed due to the financial crash and worked for pretty bad employers. I guess gambling/trading gave me the same hope that the lottery has but that it felt more realistic a dream to stumble across some sort of system that might get me out of my one bedroom flat and into being able to own my own home and not have that permanent worry about money. My brother also has severe mental health issues and was effectively made homeless by the coalition government when the austerity cuts hit for a few weeks in 2016 which made me double down on my efforts as I never wanted my family to go through that again so sought to try and make money to deal with that.

But after 20 years and now in my mid-40s, I've read almost everything there is to read about systems, I've paid tipsters, invested in automated betting software, trying spread betting on IG and countless other things I haven't even come close to making the money I lost back in order to break even.

Is it completely hopeless? Has anyone ever made it work or successfully made back a massive chunk they have lost over the years? Or even just stumbled across a system that works for them after many years? At the moment I've resorted to putting anywhere between £2 and £10 on ridiculous 20 leg accumulators in an attempt to win my money back which seems ridiculous and is just increasing that losses figure.

Can anyone recommend any other way to make a decent amount of cash every month? I'm not a shirker and always happy to put the graft in but everything just seems impossible - I've tried dropshipping, buying and selling at auctions, share trading, doing things on fivver, etc but after almost two decades of trying am now thinking I should just accept that this is my lot.

Hi people im 20 years old, have gambled since i was 15/16 but the last year has been the worst. I cant trust myself with debit cards when money goes into the bank i know straight away where its going. Last night i won £1200 on roulette went to sleep knowing i would never see that money. I planned to spend the 1000 on clothes ect so id have something from it. I woke up and cancled the withdrawal and lost it within a hour. Im hopelessly addicted and just fed up at the age of 20 its disgusting. Ive tried to start today by self excluding myself with all online betting accounts but i just need some support and advice hopefully from anyone who is reading this and understands my pain that im going though. I hope that in a years time I can look back and made improvements with it all and hope i can help others in the same situation. My dad likes a punt and knows i do too, he is very ill at the moment and i cant share what im going though because i feel it will damage his situation. Please help guys 🙁

[harry_rag]

With the best will in the world you're probably better going down the route of the available support for people with a gambling problem rather than coming to a site where, by and large, people enjoy gambling as a responsible hobby. There may be some people here who've gotten into difficulties and can relate more and perhaps provide some useful input but, as I say, there are better routes for you to go down to get the help and support you apparently need.

As it's Safer Gambling week, this would seem a sensible starting point.

https://safergamblinguk.org/#

Maybe give the helpline a call. 

 

[StevieDay1983]

On 11/11/2023 at 9:25 PM, leroxog said:

Hi people im 20 years old, have gambled since i was 15/16 but the last year has been the worst. I cant trust myself with debit cards when money goes into the bank i know straight away where its going. Last night i won £1200 on jackpot247 (roulette) went to sleep knowing i would never see that money. I planned to spend the 1000 on clothes ect so id have something from it. I woke up and cancled the withdrawal and lost it within a hour. Im hopelessly addicted and just fed up at the age of 20 its disgusting. Ive tried to start today by self excluding myself with all online betting accounts but i just need some support and advice hopefully from anyone who is reading this and understands my pain that im going though. I hope that in a years time I can look back and made improvements with it all and hope i can help others in the same situation. My dad likes a punt and knows i do too, he is very ill at the moment and i cant share what im going though because i feel it will damage his situation. Please help guys 🙁

Hi @leroxog,

If you think you’re suffering from problem gambling and you require support, it’s important that you seek professional help from one of the following organisations who can provide the help that you need:

• https://www.gamcare.org.uk/
• https://www.begambleaware.org/
• https://www.gamblersanonymous.org.uk/

[Torque]

1 hour ago, harry_rag said:

With the best will in the world you're probably better going down the route of the available support for people with a gambling problem rather than coming to a site where, by and large, people enjoy gambling as a responsible hobby. There may be some people here who've gotten into difficulties and can relate more and perhaps provide some useful input but, as I say, there are better routes for you to go down to get the help and support you apparently need.

As it's Safer Gambling week, this would seem a sensible starting point.

https://safergamblinguk.org/#

Maybe give the helpline a call. 

 

All good advice @harry_rag but personally even if it's just to act as an ear I don't mind someone posting on here. Something less formal than what you suggest might be all someone needs and might make the world of difference.

[Fader]

Important to know the right avenues to find some support for GA. If it gets out of hand.

On the other hand, perhaps it's a good idea for us to have a thread for people to talk about these issues, too.

Applaud the replies here. The forum isn't just about gambling. It's become somewhat of a family over several years.

[Zilzalian]

I am sure i read a different post by a different member than this one the other day on this subject. (confused)

[Zilzalian]

I would suggest that a gambling habit is innate that is to say for example every Victoria Cross recipient/hero was a gambler so it is very difficult to give up, An American psychologist did a lot of research on gambling addictions and he discovered that gambling wasn't the primary problem it was losing that was the problem, he recommended that to curb the addiction one must have more than one bet in each race, i'm not sure i agree with that but he got positive results from it, My suggestion for what its worth is to vastly reduce stakes, a general rule that was bandied around years ago was never gamble more than 5% of your income in any given pay cycle. I would go beyond that and say just have a small bet every day your still gambling but on a manageable/harmless level. I think @LEE-GRAYS had a good thing going with his daily Lucky 15's although he lost overall it only cost him just over £1 a day but he still retained the possibility of a good return. Many years ago when i used to bet on football i used to pick 4 teams i thought would win and put £2 quid on the acca then a 50p line with a fifth added then another 50p line with a sixth added (total £3) my best win was £350 for just those small stakes when i got 6/6 on one occasion. So in conclusion, An Addict has a stakes problem as do may that have gambling/losing problems.

[Gary66]

It’s very difficult nowadays to gain the upper hand with all bogs taken away . First of all I think you have to learn that singles are the way forward. Bookies hate them, do lots of research learn the the value of RPRs versus OR course distance going , jockeys who have won on the horse before and most of all patience and value is key if the above sounds like to much trouble stick with fun lucky fifteens 

[MCLARKE]

I agree that professional help is required, I think most of us on here bet for fun and realise (usually afer many years) that gambling is not going to be the way to make a living (unless you are a bookie).

[Skittle]

How about focusing on your dad during his illness and not on yourself. Surely your dad means more to you. You are able to help yourself as well by doing this.

[harrisman]

Thoughts about betting/trading.

Interesting discussion.I wonder how many people know a pro punter personally.I know 3 and they are probably the exact opposite of what the general public would regard as a full time gambler. Although very different in many ways the 2 main things they have in common is - firstly a very strict focused specialist area and secondly a very unemotional approach to things. Of course without saying they are very disciplined in attitude and have a serious work ethic and very realistic about annual profits. All are quite happy with 10%ROI.

One of them also trades a lot and the best advice he gave me was ignorant newbies get eaten alive by the sharks on the exchanges and until you learn to read the markets increasing the stake just increases your losses. Another great piece of advice , much harder of course in practice, is when punting how important it is to get rid of losing bets- always go for the price you want which must be heavily weighted in your favour with regard to your own interpretation of what the market should be.If in doubt dont wager and wait for another opportunity- research is never wasted and if anyone finds that too much hard work then expecting to make a profit long term is delusional. 

The other thing they all have in common is detailed 6 monthly reviews of results negative and positive and if there are any conclusions which can be drawn from these. They all pay attention in particular to the losing bets.

Horse racing in particular is a fascinating sport betting wise in that you can get winners at prices occassionally which are very very rare prices in other sports which leads a lot of novice punters into unrealistic expectations of profits made easily.And it's also the greatest sport for attracting longterm mug punters who are emotionally attached to trainers/jockeys etc who will make the market. 

Concentrating is the name of the game.

Of course if you want to punt for fun that's fine, have a separate small pot completely away from your other finances and consider it money lost.

I have a mate who always has a punt, roughly the cost of a pint when he watches a soccer or rugby game in the pub.Usually against his own team then if his team lose his winnings pay for the snifters!

 

 

[Maxi Stavros]

I have given up placing pre match football bets, the odds are so well set and it is really so difficult. Take this weekends results, I thought matches Liverpool to beat Man Utd, Man City to beat Palace, Leeds to beat Coventry, Bolton to beat Bristol Rovers, Celtic to beat Hearts were the most certain home wins and not one won. I’ve been placing bets for over 20 years on pre match football and would be surprised if I’ve ever had a profitable season. 

I am trying in play ‘rollers’ as a last role of the dice. I was watching one tipster starting with £10 and placing in play bets, it’s usually on another goal to be scored, over 0.5 FHGs or a team to score. I was surprised how often he was hitting 10 winning bets on the bounce, usually average odds of around 1.40. If you successfully hit 10 winning bets without banking any you’re close to £300 in profit. 

Of course the argument against this is that if the odds are set accurately by the bookies and factors in a margin in their favour then it’s impossible to win unless there are customer friendly results and luck is on your side. 

My main focus with gambling is pre race training on the exchanges. I’ve heard and read that it is beatable and it is this type of gambling which people are paying premium rate commission as their profits are over £250k. I bought the Caan Berry video course, oh my goodness what a waste of money. I’m not fuming though as would I have known about this without his YouTube videos? Some of the clips on the video course he’s just sipping his cuppa whilst clicking random £50 bets without even saying why or what he’s seen. He also gives advice that when the odds start falling just hold your nerve and do not lay off until you get to race start. But with watching markets for months that’s clearly not right, almost all odd bounce back. Caan Berry also says he trades by backing to lay the favourite but from watching hundreds of markets laying to back the favourite is far more profitable. 

I saw someone above write ‘ignorant newbies get eaten by the sharks until you learn to read the markets’. This is so true, I learnt the hard way here. Having watched Caan Berry’s course and eager to try it, I was placing £50 back to lay trades. I really had no idea what was happening in the markets and soon found myself in bad positions where the odds drifted out and faced losing £15 if I layed off, so I’d let the bet go in play looking to lay off to either break even or make a profit but quickly lost my whole pot. Since those early attempts I’ve just been concentrating on trying to read and understand the markets and not placing any trades because I totally agree until you believe you can interpret the market and what is likely to happen with the favourite in the final 6 minutes it’s absolutely pointless trying to trade. 

As for Leroxog looking for help, I agree this in not the right place sorry. There is a forum on psych forums for help with gambling addiction. What I’d say to you is that if you want to bet/gamble keep your stakes very sensible. Know how much you’re only willing to lose each day or week and never go over that. I’m definitely a gambling addict, I love it but I believe I’m always in control of how much I bet, even if I do have times where I am on a long losing streak and frustrated  

Also I’d like to point out you can never win long term on roulette or slots. Every bet you place has a negative value so long term you can only be down. You may have a lucky session and make some good profits but you’ll hit a lot more unlucky sessions. 

I had a friend who was out of control, he was betting £100 a bet and even placed a £1000 bet on a football match. He had a major blow out and lost money given to him to him to help buy a house and was so troubled obviously by it. When I spoke to him about his gambling he said that he likes to bet big as he loves winning big, winning £30 from a £5 bet seemed pointless to him. But he had lost all realisation of the value of money. Only gamble with ‘spare’ money, all your monthly bills must always take priority.

Ultimately, do not gamble if you cannot control how much you bet. 

Edited December 19, 2023 by Maxi Stavros