Argentina > Primera Division > 2012

[MNC]

Re: Argentina > Primera Division > 2012

only 1:0 :\

I thought there could be a few goals as well but most importantly it was going to be a home win, so even though I just read this I wouldn't have helped much.

[McNasara]

Re: Argentina > Primera Division > 2012

I thought there could be a few goals as well but most importantly it was going to be a home win' date=' so even though I just read this I wouldn't have helped much.[/quote'] No problem mate. Team news for likely crucial match for the title at La Bombonera: Silva and Mouche won't play for Boca tonight. Two of three other strikers (Blandi, Viatri, Cvitanich) will replace them. Defender Clemente Rodriguez is injured. Arsenal don't have important missings since topscorer Zelaya is back.

[MPLouis]

Re: Argentina > Primera Division > 2012

Boca v Arsenal Sunday 17th June 23.15 Top placed Boca play 3rd placed Arsenal. There is one more game after this one. Arsenal are 1 point behind. Arsenal are in better recent form. Boca are in the Copa Libertadores and this could be a distraction for them. Boca's home form is better than Arsenal's away form. Boca have a better head to head record for games between the two teams. http://uk.soccerway.com/national/argentina/primera-division/2011-2012/clausura/ Best current odds: Boca 1.8 Draw 3.6 Arsenal 5.1 With better form and a greater need for the points, I think Arsenal are good value here at 5.1. The 'Arsenal or Draw' bet gives a margin of safety - Double Chance Arsenal or Draw 2.1 Paddy Power Strength (confidence I have in the value of the bet): 3/10 (Note: odds could improve between now and kick off)

Result: Boca 0 Arsenal 3 Arsenal dominated this game from the first minute, and didn't look back after taking the lead in the third minute. Boca were really disappointing and never really looked like coming back. This win leaves Arsenal level with Tigre at the top and Boca trailing in third after looking favourites earlier. Bet won :ok Stake: 3 points Return: 6.3 Profit: 3.3 points

[tommy schnurmann]

Re: Argentina > Primera Division > 2012 it is pretty sad to see teams with ridiculous fan base like Arsenal and Tigre fight for the title when meanwhile great traditional teams with huge support in the country like River, San Lorenzo and Rosario Central struggle for a place in Primera Division next season. But well it is football and the hinchada doesnt play on the pitch. i dont see how River Plate has this difficulties to achieve the promotion anyway with the squad they have and why Central loses against Chacarita at home with the season on the line is beyond my grasp. Anyway disappointing thing that Arsenal and Tigre pay very poorly for next weekend, for @1.7 i would have certainly backed them with meaningless games for Belgrano and Independiente. Anybody thinks there is still any life in Banfield team, since they should be more motivitated than Colon, or will they just keep losing until relegation is sealed?

[Bagzi]

Re: Argentina > Primera Division > 2012 [TABLE=class: couponTable, width: 617]

[TR] [TH=class: firstColumn, align: left]Friday 22 June 2012[/TH] [TH]Home[/TH] [TH]Draw[/TH] [TH]Away[/TH] [TH=class: bppWidth]BPP[/TH] [/TR] [TR=class: row0, bgcolor: #F0F0F0] [TD=align: center][/TD] [TD=class: firstColumn, align: left]Olimpo v Argentinos Juniors (19:00 BST)[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]2.98[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]3.25[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]2.6[/TD] [TD=class: bppWidth bpp, align: center]102.79 %[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [/TR] [TR=class: row1] [TD=align: center][/TD] [TD=class: firstColumn, align: left]Newell's Old Boys v CA Lanus (23:15 BST)[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]2.2[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]3.35[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]3.9[/TD] [TD=class: bppWidth bpp, align: center]100.95 %[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [/TR] [TR] [TH] [/TH] [TH=class: firstColumn, align: left]Sunday 24 June 2012[/TH] [TH]Home[/TH] [TH]Draw[/TH] [TH]Away[/TH] [TH=class: bppWidth]BPP[/TH] [/TR] [TR=class: row0, bgcolor: #F0F0F0] [TD=align: center][/TD] [TD=class: firstColumn, align: left]Racing Club v Vélez Sársfield (00:20 BST)[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]3.05[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]3.15[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]2.62[/TD] [TD=class: bppWidth bpp, align: center]102.70 %[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [/TR] [TR=class: row1] [TD=align: center][/TD] [TD=class: firstColumn, align: left]Arsenal de Sarandi v Belgrano (19:00 BST)[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]1.53[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]4.33[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]7.5[/TD] [TD=class: bppWidth bpp, align: center]101.63 %[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [/TR] [TR=class: row0, bgcolor: #F0F0F0] [TD=align: center][/TD] [TD=class: firstColumn, align: left]CA All Boys v Boca Juniors (19:00 BST)[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]4.3[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]3.4[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]2[/TD] [TD=class: bppWidth bpp, align: center]102.67 %[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [/TR] [TR=class: row1] [TD=align: center][/TD] [TD=class: firstColumn, align: left]CA Banfield v Colon de Santa Fe (19:00 BST)[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]2.66[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]3.25[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]3[/TD] [TD=class: bppWidth bpp, align: center]101.70 %[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [/TR] [TR=class: row0, bgcolor: #F0F0F0] [TD=align: center][/TD] [TD=class: firstColumn, align: left]CA Tigre v Independiente (19:00 BST)[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]1.5[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]4.3[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]8.4[/TD] [TD=class: bppWidth bpp, align: center]101.83 %[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [/TR] [TR=class: row1] [TD=align: center][/TD] [TD=class: firstColumn, align: left]Godoy Cruz de Mendoza v Atlético de Rafaela (19:00 BST)[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]3.6[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]3.3[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]2.55[/TD] [TD=class: bppWidth bpp, align: center]97.30 %[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [/TR] [TR=class: row0, bgcolor: #F0F0F0] [TD=align: center][/TD] [TD=class: firstColumn, align: left]San Lorenzo v San Martin-San Juan (19:00 BST)[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]2.14[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]3.35[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]3.75[/TD] [TD=class: bppWidth bpp, align: center]103.25 %[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [/TR] [TR=class: row1] [TD=align: center][/TD] [TD=class: firstColumn, align: left]Unión de Santa Fe v Estudiantes de La Plata (19:00 BST)[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]2.58[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]3.1[/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd, align: center]3.12[/TD] [TD=class: bppWidth bpp, align: center]103.07 %[/TD] [/TR] [/TABLE]

[tommy schnurmann]

Re: Argentina > Primera Division > 2012 definately the first campeonato since Argentinos title win 2010 that looked very fishy to me, especially how it worked out to have Grondonas Arsenal campeon and Tigre safe from relegation. Newells with many dreadful away performances in a row when they had the title race in their hand, Boca with very poor performance at 0-3 against Arsenal, Tigre beats San Lorenzo who have 2 players sent off, beats Velez who seem unmotivated, state then in the media avoiding relegation but missing title would be ok for them to play 2-2 against poor Independiente to reach exactly that. San Lorenzo achieve promocion playoffs with win after 0-2 ht against Newells and win against 10-men San Martin. Its Grondonas house so he can do as he wish and like i said past campeonatos looked normal despite the accusations of anti-grondona people and media. However not that i lost with argentinian footie, backed Arsenal anyway last week unfortunately bookies wont pay out my Banfield-Colon Ahc away back this week i guess.

[MNC]

Re: Argentina > Primera Division > 2012

definately the first campeonato since Argentinos title win 2010 that looked very fishy to me, especially how it worked out to have Grondonas Arsenal campeon and Tigre safe from relegation. Newells with many dreadful away performances in a row when they had the title race in their hand, Boca with very poor performance at 0-3 against Arsenal, Tigre beats San Lorenzo who have 2 players sent off, beats Velez who seem unmotivated, state then in the media avoiding relegation but missing title would be ok for them to play 2-2 against poor Independiente to reach exactly that. San Lorenzo achieve promocion playoffs with win after 0-2 ht against Newells and win against 10-men San Martin. Its Grondonas house so he can do as he wish and like i said past campeonatos looked normal despite the accusations of anti-grondona people and media. However not that i lost with argentinian footie, backed Arsenal anyway last week unfortunately bookies wont pay out my Banfield-Colon Ahc away back this week i guess.

Boca gave out the championship, I have no doubts about it. That's the most fishy thing this semester. I have my reasons to explain it (besides the obvious Arsenal-Grondona link). Arsenal is an unbelievable champion but a fair one, they've won many games and I can't remember any strange refereeing helping them. Tigre was "helped" in some games but you don't do 63 points in a season only with help. Great season by them, hats off and fair 2nd place. Newell's is just a crap team that found some tactical order with Martin, won some games and in the end went back to normal. 6 months ago they had ended Apertura with only 1 win in 19 matches so the 32 points they did was much more than expected because they had basically the same team.

[tommy schnurmann]

Re: Argentina > Primera Division > 2012 a reason i picked Arsenal to beat Boca Juniors last week was the 2 matches they had in Copa Libertadores when the situation was very difficult for Boca with standings Fluminense 6, Arsenal 3, Boca 1, Venezuela team 1. In sarandi Boca won 2-1 after 0-1 deficit, cant say/remember much about this one, then in Bombonera Boca had a player sent off near end of the 1st half, they score the 1-0 beginning of second half and i cant remember Arsenal had any clear goal opportunities after this though they had around 75% possession and it didnt look like they would be really pushing. Then there was the quarter-final against Fluminense when there was clear handball in Bocas penalty box which could give Fluminense the very important away goal in this tie and the same colombian referee about whom Corinthians already complained cause of his performance in Emelec-Timao denied the pk and Fluminense coach said after the game we played 10 vs 12 here and this guy isnt even a referee but a clown who does what conmebol tells him to do. this and the fact boca was saving regular starters made me think that maybe Grondona guarenteed them free pass to group stage and using his influence in conmebol to choose referees later in Libertadores when they would help Arsenal to win the title since he wont be much longer in charge in AFA and clock is ticking. But thats just wild speculation from my part. Didnt say or think Arsenal or Tigre won all their games with refs help or are poor teams. Like i said strange thing about Tigre is i read from them this week in ole, they would be very satisfied with salvation from relegation even if they lose title race at same time and then play 2-2 vs Indep, which works out cause San Martin loses to San Lorenzo in a game in which according media 1-1 wasnt regular and San Martin player was sent off for complaining about this That are just strange things i reckognized. Many things could be coincidence surely and i cant be sure if match-fixing is going on of course

[MNC]

Re: Argentina > Primera Division > 2012 I agree with you about the Boca-Arsenal deal in Copa Libertadores/Clausura, but no way that Grondona could pull out a stunt to take them to the final over a giant like Fluminense. Boca is big, and Flu too. I've seen a lot of bad refereeing in Copa Libertadores, but never had any doubts about fair winners of the competition. In fact I'm sure I've seen much worst refereeing in Champions League in the past. Tigre started the season almost relegated and arrived at the last round almost saved. I can't imagine they just gave up the league to stay safe. They were happy with it and celebrated it almost like a championship but because of the huge season they had. And like I said, I don't like Arsenal at all like 99% of football fans in Argentina but if someone told me they were going to be champions I would have expected something very dirty but they were a fair winner. I have to admit everything they do is watched with different eyes and nothing they achieve will look clean even if it is.

a reason i picked Arsenal to beat Boca Juniors last week was the 2 matches they had in Copa Libertadores when the situation was very difficult for Boca with standings Fluminense 6, Arsenal 3, Boca 1, Venezuela team 1. In sarandi Boca won 2-1 after 0-1 deficit, cant say/remember much about this one, then in Bombonera Boca had a player sent off near end of the 1st half, they score the 1-0 beginning of second half and i cant remember Arsenal had any clear goal opportunities after this though they had around 75% possession and it didnt look like they would be really pushing. Then there was the quarter-final against Fluminense when there was clear handball in Bocas penalty box which could give Fluminense the very important away goal in this tie and the same colombian referee about whom Corinthians already complained cause of his performance in Emelec-Timao denied the pk and Fluminense coach said after the game we played 10 vs 12 here and this guy isnt even a referee but a clown who does what conmebol tells him to do. this and the fact boca was saving regular starters made me think that maybe Grondona guarenteed them free pass to group stage and using his influence in conmebol to choose referees later in Libertadores when they would help Arsenal to win the title since he wont be much longer in charge in AFA and clock is ticking. But thats just wild speculation from my part. Didnt say or think Arsenal or Tigre won all their games with refs help or are poor teams. Like i said strange thing about Tigre is i read from them this week in ole, they would be very satisfied with salvation from relegation even if they lose title race at same time and then play 2-2 vs Indep, which works out cause San Martin loses to San Lorenzo in a game in which according media 1-1 wasnt regular and San Martin player was sent off for complaining about this That are just strange things i reckognized. Many things could be coincidence surely and i cant be sure if match-fixing is going on of course

[tommy schnurmann]

Re: Argentina > Primera Division > 2012 well thats what Corinthians said about the referee after 1st leg Emelec-Corinthians http://globoesporte.globo.com/futebol/times/corinthians/noticia/2012/05/com-palavrao-e-nova-palavra-tite-tambem-ataca-arbitragem-no-equador.html and Fluminense coach Abel Braga after Boca-Flu 1st leg http://globoesporte.globo.com/futebol/libertadores/noticia/2012/05/abel-critica-arbitro-e-dispara-contra-conmebol-nao-quer-final-brasileira.html it is what it is, but in Europe Ovrebo made more mistakes and possibly brasil teams are just pissed off cause there arent all-brasil-finals allowed anymore. So you could be right.

[MNC]

Re: Argentina > Primera Division > 2012 Referees in Southamerica are normally home side oriented...like it happens everywhere in the world and this doesn't mean Boca was fixed to reach the finals. The last 2 weeks they had under control a great team like Universidad de Chile. They used their experience to qualify without much problems and not even concede a goal against the best attacking team of SouthAmerica ! I'm sure Brazilian teams had their share of wrong calls, for example Velez at Santos had their goalkeeper sent off in a play that for me was just another Neymar flop. And I'm not defending Boca or Velez, I want to see them lose always. I'm a Corinthians fan this week ! :P What do you mean there are no all-brasil finals anymore ?

[tommy schnurmann]

Re: Argentina > Primera Division > 2012 well that they changed the rules so that 2 teams from same country have to face each other in semi-final no matter what the draw says, after Libertadores finals 2005 and 2006 were all-brasilian affair. Of course theoretically it is still possible that teams from same country face each other in final. But only when there are 3 semifinalists from same confederation.

[MNC]

Re: Argentina > Primera Division > 2012

well that they changed the rules so that 2 teams from same country have to face each other in semi-final no matter what the draw says' date=' after Libertadores finals 2005 and 2006 were all-brasilian affair. Of course theoretically it is still possible that teams from same country face each other in final. But only when there are 3 semifinalists from same confederation.[/quote'] Hehe, come on, they are pissed off about that ? And if I'm not wrong that rule was never used so far. Or maybe they are angry because in the last 20 years every time an Argentine team played a Brazilian in a final, they lost. :P I hope they break this streak this year !! ;) Like I said, referees tend to help home sides everywhere and in Copa Libertadores it has happened ALWAYS. To see Grondona's hand pushing Boca to the final is crazy in my opinion.

[tommy schnurmann]

Re: Argentina > Primera Division > 2012 it was used here i think http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_Copa_Libertadores and in Copa Sudamericana quite some times where it affected brazilians and argentinians. as far as i remember from forums brasilians didnt like it back then when it was changed and sometime when i read about brazilian football on globo esporte for betting purposes people complain there about conmebol in comment section. Its not like i care to much or are big fan of brazilian football anyway. Usually all-brasilian ties seem more boring to me anyway when i watch Libertadores like Corinthians-Vasco and Corinthians-Santos compared to Boca-La U. But think many Brasilians will also support Boca. They are a bit similar that they have many fans but everybody else hates them. I often read from brazilians Corinthians is to hyped by national media, they are arrogant with promos like that

and refs help them. So similar things that boca-haters say in Argentina.

[MNC]

Re: Argentina > Primera Division > 2012 Yes, you are right, it was used in 2007 and I didn't remember it. They probably complained back then, but it has nothing to do with what happened this year. Actually Boca was a fair winner in those 2 legs. Flu had to play both without Deco and Fred and they were not the same team. Anyway, my final opinion about fixes is what I said. A penalty not given in the 1st half of a 1st leg of a QF game can't be an excuse to see a fixed champion.

[McNasara]

Re: Argentina > Primera Division > 2012 [TABLE=class: couponTable]

[TR] [TH][/TH] [TH=class: firstColumn]Thursday 28 June 2012[/TH] [TH]Home[/TH] [TH]Draw[/TH] [TH]Away[/TH] [TH=class: bppWidth]BPP[/TH] [/TR] [TR=class: row0] [TD][/TD] [TD=class: firstColumn]Instituto de Córdoba v San Lorenzo (21:10 BST) [/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd] 2.6 [/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd] 3.2 [/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd] 3 [/TD] [TD=class: bppWidth bpp]103.04 %[/TD] [/TR] [TR=class: row1] [TD] [/TD] [TD=class: firstColumn]Rosario Central v San Martin-San Juan (23:15 BST) [/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd] 2.3 [/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd] 3.3 [/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd] 4.05 [/TD] [TD=class: bppWidth bpp]98.47 %[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TH][/TH] [TH=class: firstColumn]Sunday 1 July 2012[/TH] [TH]Home[/TH] [TH]Draw[/TH] [TH]Away[/TH] [TH=class: bppWidth]BPP[/TH] [/TR] [TR=class: row0] [TD][/TD] [TD=class: firstColumn]San Lorenzo v Instituto de Córdoba (18:10 BST) [/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd] 2.75 [/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd] 3.1 [/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd] 2.6 [/TD] [TD=class: bppWidth bpp]107.08 %[/TD] [/TR] [TR=class: row1] [TD] [/TD] [TD=class: firstColumn]San Martin-San Juan v Rosario Central (20:20 BST) [/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd] 3.8 [/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd] 3.1 [/TD] [TD=class: selectionBestOdd] 2.05 [/TD] [TD=class: bppWidth bpp]107.35 %[/TD] [/TR] [/TABLE]

[chileantipster]

Re: Argentina > Primera Division > 2012 Whoever published those odds on San Lorenzo should be fired!! Huge value in the 1st match and of course in the 2nd leg the average is at 1.8. For the 2nd leg, the 1st divisions teams has the "sports advantage" it means Instituto needs to win by 3 goals and Rosario needs to win as away.