UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August

[Mustafa]

	Tuesday 16 August 2011	Home	Draw	Away	BPP
	Arsenal v Udinese (19:45 BST)	1.5	4.25	8	102.70 %
	FC BATE Borisov v SK Puntigamer Sturm Graz (19:45 BST)	1.94	3.5	4.2	103.93 %
	FC København v FC Viktoria Plzen (19:45 BST)	1.76	3.65	5.15	103.63 %
	FC Twente v Benfica (19:45 BST)	2.52	3.3	2.87	104.77 %
	Olympique Lyonnais v Rubin Kazan (19:45 BST)	1.75	3.85	5.06	102.88 %
	Wednesday 17 August 2011	Home	Draw	Away	BPP
	Dinamo Zagreb v Malmö FF (19:45 BST)	1.75	3.8	5.04	103.30 %
	FC Bayern München v FC Zürich (19:45 BST)	1.22	6.75	13	104.33 %
	Maccabi Haifa v Racing Genk (19:45 BST)	2.14	3.5	4	100.30 %
	Odense BK v Villarreal (19:45 BST)	3.7	3.4	2.14	103.17 %
	Wisla Kraków v APOEL (19:45 BST)	1.96	3.6	4.25	102.33 %

[Mustafa]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August I know it's early but guessed punters would want to discuss games in advance :ok

[ValueHunter]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August No predictions but some initial thoughts of mine: I think Arsenal might have a trouble with Udinese. Last year Italians struggled against well packed teams but against open teams like Arsenal they produced a lot of goals. Here are some examples: Milan - Udinese 4-4; Udinese - Inter 3-1; Udinese - Napoli 3-1. Now of course Udinese are weakened with the leaving of key players like Sanchez, Zapata and Inler but gunners also have their problems. Let's wait and see what would happen with Nasri and Cesc, how bad is the injury of RVP, will Walcott make his return from ankle injury till then. At first glance Rubin Kazan is underrated once again and Lyon might worth a lay at this price. Russians shouldn't be priced so high for a team who have just defeated Dynamo Kyiv.

[Punterus Maximus]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August Price for FC København WIN is already diving to 1.65 in Unibet. I think that for Danish champions to qualify for group stage of CL is a must, that for one, they are in good shape that's two, and faicing Victoria Plzen, which of course eliminated Rosenborg, but it ain't strong and fearsome Rosenborg that it used to be, it's now a medicore team in medicore european league. It's possible that odds for FCK will drop down to 1,4 in my opinion.

[SharQ Bettor]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August Some early thoughts... FC Copenhagen - Plzen Both teams seems to have good offensive capabilities. Over 2.25 for 1.94 @ 188Bet seems to be tempting. :hope Twente - Benfica I have sympathy for both teams and I rate Benfica one class above this Twente team. The only problem that Benfica might have is that they approach this away match with a lame-ass attitude. Since both teams are attacking minded and have offensive power and even though this is the first match in which home teams try to prevent an away goal, again over 2.25 for 1.98 @ SBOBET seems to be tempting. :hope Lyon - Rubin Kazan Rubin will play for a draw. They have already played many matches in the Russian premier league whereas Lyon has played only one match. I doubt whether Lyon have the creativity, passing game and the offensive power to win by a big margin. Kazan +0.75 for 2.06 @ Pinnacle Sports could be a good option. :unsure

[Mustafa]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August

No predictions but some initial thoughts of mine: I think Arsenal might have a trouble with Udinese. Last year Italians struggled against well packed teams but against open teams like Arsenal they produced a lot of goals. Here are some examples: Milan - Udinese 4-4; Udinese - Inter 3-1; Udinese - Napoli 3-1. Now of course Udinese are weakened with the leaving of key players like Sanchez, Zapata and Inler but gunners also have their problems. Let's wait and see what would happen with Nasri and Cesk, how bad is the injury of RVP, will Walcott make his return from ankle injury till then. At first glance Rubin Kazan is underrated once again and Lyon might worth a lay at this price. Russians shouldn't be priced so high for a team who have just defeated Dynamo Kyiv.

Good point about Rubin and they might get something for this game. As for Arsenal, please note that Van Persie is suspended after his red card against Barcelona. Both to score might be a decent bet which most likely will be available @ 1.80-1.90 and it is much better option in my opinion than Arsenal @ 1.50.

[ValueHunter]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August

please note that Van Persie is suspended after his red card against Barcelona.

Thanks for reminding, I completely forgot about his suspension. It will be a huge blow for Arsenal, Chamakh is nowhere close to Persie.

Kazan +0.75 for 2.06 @ Pinnacle Sports could be a good option. :unsure

Yeah this one looks awesome. I hope bet365 will set odds close to Pinnacle's when the CL market is up.

[RocknRolla]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August

Yeah this one looks awesome. I hope bet365 will set odds close to Pinnacle's when the CL market is up.

Kazan +0,75 @ evens with 365 now

[Alessan]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August My initial two-cents about DINAMO Zagreb Vs Malmo FF I still can't evaluate the price of 1,75 (slided to 1,70 @ Bet365) on home win... And I must say I'm overestimating Dinamo because I'm their supporter. If the price was 2,00 I'd say go for it... Dinamo is playing very well this season, looking better from match to match... Malmo, on the other hand eliminated Glasgow Rangers, which says a lot. I think I'll wait to see what team news will be given form Zagreb, and post here. I hope that Dinamo can take the first game, and I most probably will bet on home win, hoping that striker Rukavina can hold current form (3 goals and an 1 assist in three games), and that Sammir and Badelj can play a game like they did against Villareal last season...

[Ricardinho]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August Alessan can you tell me why your club has like 2000 people when its a seriematch then when its EL or CL qualify u got 25 000+. Dinamo favorites ofc playing at home etc but dont understimate Malmö.

[Alessan]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August

Alessan can you tell me why your club has like 2000 people when its a seriematch then when its EL or CL qualify u got 25 000+. Dinamo favorites ofc playing at home etc but dont understimate Malmö.

It's a pretty easy question... The "Bad blue boys" - supporters of Dinamo are in boycott, because of disagreement with the board, and especially with Mr. Zdravko Mamic. And until this summer, the "Maksimir" stadium was in terrible condition and almost noone was willing to pay the ticket and watch bad croatian league football there. Now, Dinamo is stronger, the stadium is renovated, european matches are interesting and Maksimir will be full once again. I didn't underestimate Malmo, I respect the fact they have eliminated Gl. Rangers, but I still see Dinamo wining first leg. At least, they are capable of winning first match and fighting to qualify in other, away game.

[beer]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August me agree about the Kazan vs Lyon game , Kazan Rubin +1 AH odds 1.675 is worth a try , i havent seen Lyon playing in preseason but i have seen a lot of Rubin games and i can tell that , if they will only defend in France than there will be big problems for Lyon to score , because Rubin are playing very organised and almost all players are hardworking type. +Lyon might lose Bastos

[Ricardinho]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August

It's a pretty easy question... The "Bad blue boys" - supporters of Dinamo are in boycott, because of disagreement with the board, and especially with Mr. Zdravko Mamic. And until this summer, the "Maksimir" stadium was in terrible condition and almost noone was willing to pay the ticket and watch bad croatian league football there. Now, Dinamo is stronger, the stadium is renovated, european matches are interesting and Maksimir will be full once again. I didn't underestimate Malmo, I respect the fact they have eliminated Gl. Rangers, but I still see Dinamo wining first leg. At least, they are capable of winning first match and fighting to qualify in other, away game.

Why you talk crap i just read the tickets cost 1 euro. :loon

[ValueHunter]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August

Why you talk crap i just read the tickets cost 1 euro. :loon

He mentioned about a boycott, if that's the case even a free entry can not make fans to go to the stadium. He also said until this summer.

[Ricardinho]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August

He mentioned about a boycott' date=' if that's the case even a free entry can not make fans to go to the stadium. He also said [u']until this summer.

I mean they got 2000 fans at seriematches then at uefa matches they got 250000 and he said some bullshit reasons why then i just found out the tickets in uefa matches costs 1 euro. :loon edit : the boycott is of Bad Blue Boys or something and they are like 2-3000 in that group (maybe less)

[Plavi24]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August

My initial two-cents about DINAMO Zagreb Vs Malmo FF I still can't evaluate the price of 1,75 (slided to 1,70 @ Bet365) on home win... And I must say I'm overestimating Dinamo because I'm their supporter. If the price was 2,00 I'd say go for it... Dinamo is playing very well this season, looking better from match to match... Malmo, on the other hand eliminated Glasgow Rangers, which says a lot. I think I'll wait to see what team news will be given form Zagreb, and post here. I hope that Dinamo can take the first game, and I most probably will bet on home win, hoping that striker Rukavina can hold current form (3 goals and an 1 assist in three games), and that Sammir and Badelj can play a game like they did against Villareal last season...

I consider 1,75 very nice odds for this game.Malmo eliminating Rangers does say something,but Rangers dominating in the 2nd leg with 10,and later even 9 players says a lot too.So does Malmo losing to a team from Faroe Island till scoring an eaquliser in the 90th minute in the 2nd leg of the 2nd qualy round.They are 9th in their domestic league.Malmo actually has a friendly game vs Milan on Sunday,just 3 days before this game,they cant cancel it now,and that shows what were their expectations about coming this far in these qualies.Add to all this that we're rising in form every game,last week winning 2-0 and today 5-0 in the league with very good performances.Handicap @2.90 is worth a try too,with smaller stakes.About some of the other matches,expecting Arsenal and Bayern to win their matches comfortably securing a solid lead before the 2nd legs.

[Plavi24]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August

I mean they got 2000 fans at seriematches then at uefa matches they got 250000 and he said some bullshit reasons why then i just found out the tickets in uefa matches costs 1 euro. :loon edit : the boycott is of Bad Blue Boys or something and they are like 2-3000 in that group (maybe less)

It's not bullshit.Be more informed before making such assumptions.The main reasons for such low visit to the league matches are the lack of competition,it is clear that we will be champions every season,and the stadium was in a bad state before renovation,add to that weather conditions especially later in the autumn/winter and that is the 2nd reason. About the Bad Blue Boys you were right,BBB are the ultras but they are a minority when you look at how many Dinamo fans there are in general.Take note that especially for these European games,there are more than few BBB actually going to the games but on different stands,and without the organised chanting. The 1kn tickets were supposed to be a promotional action for only the first game of the season because of the new look of the stadium,but they stayed even for this game and it is a bad decision.Be assured that the stadium would definitely be full in either case, with normal ticket prices too,there is a lot of interest for this game from many places all over the country.

[ValueHunter]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August

I mean they got 2000 fans at seriematches then at uefa matches they got 250000 and he said some bullshit reasons why then i just found out the tickets in uefa matches costs 1 euro. :loon edit : the boycott is of Bad Blue Boys or something and they are like 2-3000 in that group (maybe less)

Low attendance to a domestic game is a common thing you can see in every Balcan country. I really don't know why you are so surprised? It's normal for CL and EL games stadiums to be full. There are a couple of domestic games that can fill the stadiums like Partizan - Zvezda in Serbia, DInamo Zagreb v Hajduc in Croatia, Levski - CSKA in Bulgaria and lets say Steaua - Dinamo Bucuresti in Romania, all the other games in these leagues are low visited because the lack of intrigue, there are some exceptions of course but not many. In 90% of the cases one of those teams I mentioned end up as a champions in the end of the season (not sure about Romania, things are getting better there or at least we can see different teams involved in the battle for the title). Hope it's clear for you now.

[Alessan]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August

Why you talk crap i just read the tickets cost 1 euro. :loon

Actually, the tickets cost 1 croatian "kuna" = 0,2€ In any case, it seems that Dinamo bet is under pressure on the market, as it slipped down to 1,57 on Bet365... And I won't get into any more explaning why Dinamo Zagreb has so low attendance on HNL matches. Don't wanna to talk crap, as I understand it... :cigar

[ValueHunter]

Lyon v Rubin Kazan Rubin+0.75 @2.025 with bet365 As I mentioned earlier odds are not set sorrectly in my opinion. Rubin have been considered underdogs in their clash against Dynamo Kyiv and won both legs conceding only one goal. I don't rate Lyon's attacking power higher than Ukrainuans' one. Lyon failed to win at home against newly promoted Ajaccio taking only a point and that was their second official game of the season. On the other hand Rubin have already played 20 games in the Russian Premier League and 2 games in the CL qualifying rounds, so they should be in better form. Russians are strong defensive unit and rarеly lose, if they do it's not with a big margin. Given what has been said I think that +0.75(AH) is pretty generous priced and I wont ignore it. Dinamo Zagreb v Malmo Malmo +0.75 @2.050 with bet365 We have a similar case here and I will make the same bet no matter I don't know much about these two teams. I watched a bit of their CL games and I must admit I was impressed by Malmo's passing at times. The combination and the finisher for their away goal on Ibrox wеre quite impressive. Dinamo knocked out another scandinavian team - HJK Helsinki from Finland. Croatians had no worries winning the two games. However Malmo seems to be much stronger than the Finnish team. No matter some people do not rate Scotish football and Rangers in particular, they were playing an important role in the CL group stage last year after all. Blues gave a serious battle to Man Utd and Valencia back then. That's why I think Malmo made quite an achievement by defeating them. Swedes have just drew their friendly game with Milan (2:2) аs Italians equalized in the 89th minute. These results make me think Malmo should be taken serious. Another thing to consider is Malmo are currently in the middle of the table in Sweden with almost nothing left to play for so they will be fully focused on their European performance. I can't see a reason Dinamo to be so short so I will give a try to Malmo who are a valuable pick in my opinion. Even if they lose with 1 goal margin I would have half of my stake back with the bet I've taken.

[-Blackadder-]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August

Alessan can you tell me why your club has like 2000 people when its a seriematch then when its EL or CL qualify u got 25 000+. Dinamo favorites ofc playing at home etc but dont understimate Malmö.

I'd guess part of it is because these games are European games (every team's fans are louder when they play in Europe) and also because league games in Croatia are really low quality. Would you go to watch a game where you know who will win, the football is shitpoor as well and, as Alessan said, the stadium is (or was in this case) a dump? Back on topic, Bayern should win heavily. I expect Arsenal to win but not by much - let's not forget that Udinese have sold two of their best three players this summer, so Arsenal's missing players won't be as important. Villareal I can see winning too, though it's by no means a cert. Will look into Bayern -1.5. Worth noting that even if they are fit and not suspended Fabregas and Nasri may well sit the game out as they don't want to be cup-tied.

[Mustafa]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August

Lyon v Rubin Kazan Rubin+0.75 @2.025 with bet365 As I mentioned earlier odds are not set sorrectly in my opinion. Rubin have been considered underdogs in their clash against Dynamo Kyiv and won both legs conceding only one goal. I don't rate Lyon's attacking power higher than Ukrainuans' one. Lyon failed to win at home against newly promoted Ajaccio taking only a point and that was their second oficcial game of the season. On the other hand Rubin have already played 20 games in the Russian Premier League and 2 games in the CL qualifying rounds, so they should be in better form. Russians are strong defensive unit and rarеly lose, if they do it's not with a big margin. Given what has been said I think that +0.75(AH) is pretty generous priced and I wont ignore it. Dinamo Zagreb v Malmo Malmo +0.75 @2.050 with bet365 We have a similar case here and I will make the same bet no matter I don't know much about these two teams. I watched a bit of their CL games and I must admit I was impressed by Malmo's passing at times. The combination and the finisher for their away goal on Ibrox wеre quite impressive. Dinamo knocked out another scandinavian team - HJK Helsinki from Finland. Croatians had no worries winning the two games. However Malmo seems to be much stronger than the Finnish team. No matter some people do not rate Scotish football and Rangers in particular, they were playing an important role in the CL group stage last year after all. Blues gave a serious battle to Man Utd and Valencia back then. That's why I think Malmo made quite an achievement by defeating them. Swedes have just drew their friendly game with Milan (2:2) аs Italians equalized in the 89th minute. These results make me think Malmo should be taken serious. Another thing to consider is Malmo are currently in the middle of the table in Sweden with almost nothing left to play for so they will be fully focused on their European performance. I can't see a reason Dinamo to be so short so I will give a try to Malmo who are a valuable pick in my opinion. Even if they lose with 1 goal margin I would have half of my stake back with the bet I've taken.

I like your reasoning but will take a little bit different approach. These qualifying games are unpredictable mainly because a team can lose the first leg at home and then go and win the away game. So, I prefer to focus on picking a team that will qualify. I will just add some points. Lyon – Rubin Rubin has signed Nelson Valdes from Hercules. I could not find anything on their website whether he will play against Lyon or not, but he might play in the return leg in Kazan, which is an added advantage to their attack. Both teams have good experience in the CL during the past years and have equal chance to qualify, so in this case Rubin represents value. Rubin to Qualify @ 2.50 (2 units) Bet365 ________________________________________________ Dinamo Zagreb – Malmo Dinamo played Neftchi in the second qualifying round and Helsinki in the third. Both teams are not that strong as Rangers. Same as with Rubin and I agree with ValueHunter that Malmo represents value. Malmo to Qualify @ 2.37 (2 units) Bet365

[Mustafa]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August I think bookies are underestimating Zurich against B.Munich. The Swiss side has played 7 competitive games this season already, including 2 games in the third qualifying round against Genk. In their last 2 games they beat Grasshoppers 6-0 at home and Basel 2-1 away. B.Munich lost their opening fixture to B.M’bach 0-1 and this weekend only managed 1-0 win away against Wolfsburg. Even though I believe the Germans will reach the group stage I can’t see them trashing Zurich. So I think that Zurich +2 AH @ 1.90-1.95 is a good price.

[BelgianPunter]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August

I think bookies are underestimating Zurich against B.Munich. The Swiss side has played 7 competitive games this season already' date=' including 2 games in the third qualifying round against Genk. In their last 2 games they beat Grasshoppers 6-0 at home and Basel 2-1 away. B.Munich lost their opening fixture to B.M’bach 0-1 and this weekend only managed 1-0 win away against Wolfsburg. Even though I believe the Germans will reach the group stage I can’t see them trashing Zurich. So I think that Zurich +2 AH @ 1.90-1.95 is a good price.

Standard :ok

[Mustafa]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August

Standard :ok

Sorry :)

[RedDevil92]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August Bayern Munich-FC Zurich Zurich no goal 2,15 vc 5pts Bayern is the much better side and also plays at home.Robben is doubtful.Bayern knows that it is more important not to concede a goal than to win 4:2.Neuer had some bad moments in the last cuople of games but on wednesday he will be focused. Zurich has not the class to reach anything in Munich.They have to produce a lot of fouls and to play a tight defense to avoid a high defeat. Munich is the much better side,they play at home,and their coach knows that they have to play to nill.Possible result 2:0. GL:ok

[HastGill1]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August

I'd guess part of it is because these games are European games (every team's fans are louder when they play in Europe) and also because league games in Croatia are really low quality. Would you go to watch a game where you know who will win, the football is shitpoor as well and, as Alessan said, the stadium is (or was in this case) a dump? Back on topic, Bayern should win heavily. I expect Arsenal to win but not by much - let's not forget that Udinese have sold two of their best three players this summer, so Arsenal's missing players won't be as important. Villareal I can see winning too, though it's by no means a cert. Will look into Bayern -1.5. Worth noting that even if they are fit and not suspended Fabregas and Nasri may well sit the game out as they don't want to be cup-tied.

Think this is fairly certain :lol..Fab now having Barca medical, Nasri to follow. Watching their game on Sat it was a case of same old, same old, plenty of possession against what was a poor side but few shots on target and little sign of any cutting edge. Gervinho looked decent and was their best player, pace to burn and enough tricks to perplex both full backs, although I'm not sure if it was him being good or their full backs being shite! Good start for him, the sending off meant nothing and is something he will learn from. We have certainly been here with Arsenal before in Europe, they don't look brilliant in the league but turn it on against sides in Europe who don't know how to defend against them and they hit 3-4-5 goals, certainly the average European sides which, after the summer transfers, we can probably include Udinese in. They will prob be stuck in their own half for a lot of the game whatever people say, as most teams that go to Arsenal are, the crowd is often pretty lame at the Emirates but I expect them to get behind the side tomorrow, no players are bigger than the team and this is obviously one of the biggest games of their season. Would be useful to get a decent preview of Udinese from Ultravires but I think Arsenal -1AH looks a decent play currently, they are still very dangerous in Europe against less streetwise teams and still have plenty of quality in the side.

[Mustafa]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August Good point HastGill1. I remember last year when Arsenal was not doing well, but in their opening game in Champions League they destroyed Braga 6-0, I think Shakhtar was beaten 6-1. After Cesc left the whole team would want to show that they can do even better without him, so many goals would not surprise me. I think there is a mistake at Bet365, they offer Arsenal -1 @ 4.00

[HastGill1]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August

Good point HastGill1. I remember last year when Arsenal was not doing well, but in their opening game in Champions League they destroyed Braga 6-0, I think Shakhtar was beaten 6-1. After Cesc left the whole team would want to show that they can do even better without him, so many goals would not surprise me. I think there is a mistake at Bet365, they offer Arsenal -1 @ 4.00

I think you are taking that from an odds comparison site but it is mistaken and the link takes you to the price for the Arsenal v Liverpool game, which Arsenal are 3/1 for the -1EH.

[Mustafa]

Re: UEFA Champions League > 16-17 August

I think you are taking that from an odds comparison site but it is mistaken and the link takes you to the price for the Arsenal v Liverpool game' date=' which Arsenal are 3/1 for the -1EH.[/quote'] Thanks for the clarification. But I won't take Arsenal on a handicap since their defence is not so good and even if Udinese lost some of their key players they still have Di Natale. I believe that the better options would be Both to Score @ 1.90 or since games at the Emirates mostly produce more goals in the second half Highest Scoring Half: 2nd @ 2.00 is another good option.