Danthepunter Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 Interesting debate i was having with a few people last night about poker and i am just after other peoples views to see if my side of argument is backed up . The debate is how much of poker is luck and how much is skill . I said that in my eyes it is 75% skill 25% luck but there was a few people saying that it is a game of 75% luck and only 25% skill what are your thoughts ? My argument is that any game where there is professionals playing at a high standard it has to be a high level skill game . Of course on any given day a lucky player can win against anyone but over a long period of time the better player will come out on top . SO HOW MUCH OF POKER IS LUCK AND HOW MUCH IS SKILL ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spooner Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 Re: Poker skill or luck ? I suppose the only thing you can do in poker and something I always try to do is get my money in when I'm infront. After that, it can be up to the poker gods but you can give yourself the best chance and if we work out that 'luck' is 50/50 then hopefully you should come out on top more times than not.... I only get annoyed if I get beat and I'm not infront, because I played bad. Well not 100% of the time because eventually you'll run into AA, its poker but If I get my money in infront, I still take something if I lose.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nade Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 Re: Poker skill or luck ? In the very immediate short term luck plays a big role in results, but over the long term a good player will win a bad player will lose. If you play 10 hands vs Ivey you can be a winner, after 1000 hands you'll be crushed into the ground. Simple. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danthepunter Posted November 4, 2010 Author Share Posted November 4, 2010 Re: Poker skill or luck ? Nade agree with you 100 % and that is the exact point i was giving in my argument . Skill will beat luck over a long period of a time . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glceud Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 Re: Poker skill or luck ? Interesting debate i was having with a few people last night about poker and i am just after other peoples views to see if my side of argument is backed up . The debate is how much of poker is luck and how much is skill . I said that in my eyes it is 75% skill 25% luck but there was a few people saying that it is a game of 75% luck and only 25% skill what are your thoughts ? My argument is that any game where there is professionals playing at a high standard it has to be a high level skill game . Of course on any given day a lucky player can win against anyone but over a long period of time the better player will come out on top . SO HOW MUCH OF POKER IS LUCK AND HOW MUCH IS SKILL ? If you got 10 players of exactly the same skill level around a table it would be 100% a game of luck. If you got anything other than that it would be somewere between 1% and 99% luck. I think if I played Ivey heads up a 100 times for a $1000 I would beat him at least once, some on here would do a lot better. For future reference or if you want to impress your mates, we replaced the word luck with the word variance in poker parlors a few years back. It sound's far more intellectual and is often used by mediocre players to explain their inability to beat other mediocre players, but still enables them to save face amongst a whole pile of other mediocre players who might one day feel the need to explain their own inability to beat some totally different group of mediocre players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlunB Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 Re: Poker skill or luck ? Nade agree with you 100 % and that is the exact point i was giving in my argument . Skill will beat luck over a long period of a time . Yep, but we rarely play over a 'long period of time' with friends and this is what gets missed in a lot of these game of skill debates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valiant23 Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 Re: Poker skill or luck ? If I play against any player, and just go all in pre flop on every 1 of a 1000 hands, how much skill is involved? :unsure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glceud Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 Re: Poker skill or luck ? If I play against any player, and just go all in pre flop on every 1 of a 1000 hands, how much skill is involved? :unsure By you none, by your opponent some assuming he knows what hand is ahead of the average holding:ok Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glceud Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 Re: Poker skill or luck ? Yep' date=' but we rarely play over a 'long period of time' with friends and this is what gets missed in a lot of these game of skill debates.[/quote'] Who's been beating you in the office this time?:eyes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warbirds Posted November 4, 2010 Share Posted November 4, 2010 Re: Poker skill or luck ? I'd say it depends on the format as well In tournaments especially turbos or short stacked affairs you need to rely on luck much more than in cash games in order to turn a profit as you will have to put your chips in in less than optimal conditions at some point As a tournament player I'd say it's 50-50 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danthepunter Posted November 4, 2010 Author Share Posted November 4, 2010 Re: Poker skill or luck ? Ivey has won 13million in torn winnings not sure how you can say its 50%skill 50% luck . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warbirds Posted November 5, 2010 Share Posted November 5, 2010 Re: Poker skill or luck ? Well Ivey has had good and bad luck and been on both sides of suck outs. I'm not denying the fact that he is most probably the best tournament player there is, or one of the best ones, thus maximizing the "skill" part of it. But the argument about the 13 million is all relative - take into account the frequency and buy-ins of games he's playing and you might have a more balanced picture. As fellow PL member Drew16 was telling me today Ivey makes no mistake that he plays cash whenever possible vs tournament - and for a single reason: minimizing the luck factor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BAM Posted November 17, 2010 Share Posted November 17, 2010 Re: Poker skill or luck ? Its neither skill or luck. It is timing and confidence :ok Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trips Posted November 18, 2010 Share Posted November 18, 2010 Re: Poker skill or luck ? I think this applies to most forms of gambling,in the shorterm luck does play a big part, in the long term its a very high percetage of skill,imo something like 95% Part of the skill in poker is knowing when to get involved in a hand PF and when to fold. thats not down luck thats skill. just winning a hand in poker dosent mean that much, the aim in poker is to win as many chips as possible in every hand you play,that also takes skill.all these very important factors can only be played properly by a skillful player. Over a long period i think luck or variation in poker may not be the main reason for a playing loosing or winning in poker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ojideagu Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 Re: Poker skill or luck ? One of the main skills in poker comes from estimating the range of hands your opponent may have based on their previous plays. A lot of that information can only be learnt from seeing showdown hands and connecting that to how they played those hands in streets. Do they bet 3 streets with top pair? Do they semi bluff straight draws? Do they overplay an Over pair? Hence why many players show bluffs on purpose or big hands. And why a lot of plays muck losing hands. It's the most vital piece of information there is. The biggest mistake many novices make is thinking poker is about guessing the EXACT hand a player has, this comes from them being deluded and hoodwinked by TV poker. Another skill at higher levels involves manipulating what your opponant thinks you have. This is the skill needed where everybody at the table is at a similar level. This can include making "illogical" plays. And sometimes playing 100% as expected can be the biggest way to trick of all. Not to mention simple bankroll management is one of the most underrated "skills" needed. And temper control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nade Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 Re: Poker skill or luck ? Ojideagu makes an excellent post :ok Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ojideagu Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 Re: Poker skill or luck ? Ojideagu makes an excellent post :ok Cheers mate! Was trying not to come across as an arrogant know it all :\ Hard sometimes, the internet is full of them :lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teaulc Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 Re: Poker skill or luck ? Was trying not to come across as an arrogant know it all :\ Hard sometimes, the internet is full of them :lol Nade`s done okay ;):tongue2:tongue2:tongue2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ojideagu Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 Re: Poker skill or luck ? Nade`s done okay ;):tongue2:tongue2:tongue2 :drums Ha Ha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bignedkelly Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Re: Poker skill or luck ? 90% luck - BAD LUCK - or at least it seems that way atm On a real stinker of a run lately but you got to know that it will turn around at some point - as long as you are doing the right things then over the peice you will end up ahead. but when its bad it can be feckin BRUTAL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esox Posted March 22, 2011 Share Posted March 22, 2011 Re: Poker skill or luck ? Interesting debate i was having with a few people last night about poker and i am just after other peoples views to see if my side of argument is backed up . The debate is how much of poker is luck and how much is skill . I said that in my eyes it is 75% skill 25% luck but there was a few people saying that it is a game of 75% luck and only 25% skill what are your thoughts ? My argument is that any game where there is professionals playing at a high standard it has to be a high level skill game . Of course on any given day a lucky player can win against anyone but over a long period of time the better player will come out on top . SO HOW MUCH OF POKER IS LUCK AND HOW MUCH IS SKILL ? Tournament wise I figure the longer the game and deeper the stacks the more skill affects the results, short turbo type games have a huge luck factor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trips Posted March 22, 2011 Share Posted March 22, 2011 Re: Poker skill or luck ? Tournament wise I figure the longer the game and deeper the stacks the more skill affects the results' date=' short turbo type games have a huge luck factor.[/quote'] True, but over a long period knowing how to play turbo's is the skill. but I agree luck will play a bigger part in each particular game. Luck will play a bigger part in the lower stakes, bad players will call you down more and get lucky when they shouldn't even be in the hand.they are also willing to gamble far more when stakes are lower, when I played a lot of freerolls i noticed a lot of very loose aggressive players really tightened up when they satellite into a $200+ tournament,they didn't last long against the better players folding far more when they shouldnt in the higher stakes due to lack of skill. The good loose aggressive players may have to get lucky sometimes but they are making moves for a reason and not blindly just relying on luck.IMO that is the biggest skill in poker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outlaw_Hood Posted March 23, 2011 Share Posted March 23, 2011 Re: Poker skill or luck ? There is a lot of skill in playing poker however online, because the donkeys are behind a computer screen and no one can see them and embarrass them with their donk play they play like donks and do get lucky. The problem is there is so many of them kind of players online that you may encounter 10 of these in a tournament and out of those ten at least 2 or 3 get lucky and take a big chunk from your stack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BAM Posted March 23, 2011 Share Posted March 23, 2011 Re: Poker skill or luck ? There is a lot of skill in playing poker however online' date=' because the donkeys are behind a computer screen and no one can see them and embarrass them with their donk play they play like donks and do get lucky. The problem is there is so many of them kind of players online that you may encounter 10 of these in a tournament and out of those ten at least 2 or 3 get lucky and take a big chunk from your stack[/quote'] So its 30% luck then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samba_SamPa Posted March 23, 2011 Share Posted March 23, 2011 Re: Poker skill or luck ? It's skill when I win, and luck when I don't Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esox Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 Re: Poker skill or luck ? It's skill when I win' date=' and luck when I don't[/quote'] Love it:lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkshire Pudding Posted March 28, 2011 Share Posted March 28, 2011 Re: Poker skill or luck ? Long term skill conquers luck but in the short term luck, or variance as most of us refer it to, is huge. In fact most people simply do not understand how much variance there is and the kind of swings you can and will face at the tables Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mabel Ohara Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 Re: Poker skill or luck ? I think poker is more 75% skills and 25% luck. In tournaments, a newbie poker player can win some hands against a skilled one (if they're really lucky), but won't really be able to win the big prize in the long run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BREEZY123 Posted September 19, 2011 Share Posted September 19, 2011 Re: Poker skill or luck ? i think it s atleast 75 percent skill cause u should knnow about positioing , post flop play , math plays a huge part in it aswell as other things, the luck part comes after adn unfortuantley it will not always be for the good thats where player reads are so important, putting themon a hand and what there ranges have been or might be helps lots:notworthy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveharris Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 Re: Poker skill or luck ? Poker is a game of skill and luck is just a bonus! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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